Airbus offers longer-range A330 with increased payload

[S V Choong 4]

Exact performance may be unknown but should be more or less as per design.

 

The original A330 performed below expectation when it was out. Only improved afterwards. Unless one is ready for the risks, it is better to stick to the safe side, especially for fragile airline like MAS. ie. the B787. Anyway, my 2 cents.

[KK Lee 5]

The original A330 performed below expectation when it was out. Only improved afterwards. Unless one is ready for the risks, it is better to stick to the safe side, especially for fragile airline like MAS. ie. the B787. Anyway, my 2 cents.

 

 

Even if the actual performance falls short, the performance (e.g. CSK) will still 15% to 20% better than current model.

[flee 5]

I remember in the 1980's, British Airways charmain, Lord King, was criticised for ordering only Boeing aircraft. They called him unpatriotic as he is not supporting Airbus, in which British Aerospace was a participating member - the British company makes the wings for all Airbus planes to this date.

 

His response was that the Airbus then (they asked him why he ordered B737s instead of A320s) was a "paper aeroplane" and British Airways will only consider the plane once it was up and flying, like the proven B737 was.

 

I think people like Azran and AJ should do well to remember those comments. The manufacturers can promise the earth and the sun. At the end of the day, the airlines will be the ones who are stuck with under performing planes and uneconomic operations! Azran must be very happy he only leased the A343s and not own them. Airlines like Thai are now stuck with the A345s and A346s, which are not as economic to operate as the B77Ws.

 

The A350 looks like it will be delayed by one year, at least. That means that D7's first A350 deliveries might not come in until 2017-2018. Meanwhile, its current A333 orders should complete deliveries by 2015. As such, the new and improved model would be just nice to cover the A350 delay.

 

I am not sure if D7 holds any further options on the A330. If they do, then it will be a simple matter to exercise them on the new 240t A333.

 

As for MH, the right thing to do is to re-furbish some of the B772s (enough to serve their routes) to the same standard as the A380 cabin to provide a standard product on long haul. They should then evaluate the A333/A350/B777/B787 once enough data on the real world operating economics is available through the manufacturers before committing any further wide body orders. Meanwhile, more capacity can be put on stream by increasing frequencies on the B772 services.

Edited July 27, 2012 by flee

[S V Choong 4]

As for MH, the right thing to do is to re-furbish some of the B772s (enough to serve their routes) to the same standard as the A380 cabin to provide a standard product on long haul. They should then evaluate the A333/A350/B777/B787 once enough data on the real world operating economics is available through the manufacturers before committing any further wide body orders. Meanwhile, more capacity can be put on stream by increasing frequencies on the B772 services.

 

***LIKE***

 

I remember in the 1980's, British Airways charmain, Lord King, was criticised for ordering only Boeing aircraft. They called him unpatriotic as he is not supporting Airbus, in which British Aerospace was a participating member - the British company makes the wings for all Airbus planes to this date.

It could be that the British has been very pro-American since end of World War II for reasons such as:

 

- The USA is the world order since World War II.

- The British has been paying the war debt towards the American, since the US has been helping them to defeat their former foes (The Germans and the Japanese in the East).

- One way to repay them is to buy US made products, just like the Republic of China government, Japanese and Germans did.

- Again as I said before, without the American assistance, the British would have been defeated by the Germans and the Japanese in the East.

 

 

UK pays off WWII debt to US

 

http://www.abc.net.a...07/s1820797.htm

Edited July 27, 2012 by S V Choong

[Isaac 0]

Azran must be very happy he only leased the A343s and not own them.

It was already a known fact that the 343 is not as economical to operate compared to the 772 back when Air Canada retired and transferred some of their 343 to D7. I suppose D7 was just very aggressive then and couldn't wait any longer, so they opted for the 343. Read on A.net that the aircraft lease is a lot cheaper for the 343 than 772, so that played a big factor In D7 to get the 343 instead or the 772. Besides, there just weren't many 772 available in the market then... well, not even now.

 

 

As for MH, the right thing to do is to re-furbish some of the B772s (enough to serve their routes) to the same standard as the A380 cabin to provide a standard product on long haul. They should then evaluate the A333/A350/B777/B787 once enough data on the real world operating economics is available through the manufacturers before committing any further wide body orders. Meanwhile, more capacity can be put on stream by increasing frequencies on the B772 services.

Just 8 months or so ago, many here were rushing MAS to place a new order for either the 787 or 350 and made it looks as if the 772 is such a fuel guzzler and not economical to operate at all and all 772 should be phased out at the soonest time possible, advisably in the next 2 or 3 years counting from last year.

 

Anyway, the 772 is definately a very competitive aircraft even by today's standard and it makes total sense to install new seats on their 772. The 772 should be good to fly well into 2018. So there is absolutely no need to rush to order the 787 or 350 now. All new plane types are bound to have some problems and MAS got so much on its plate now. So just let the more capable airlines to deal with the teething issues and MAS can always order it 2 to 3 years from now, just in time to replace their 772 in 2017/2018

Edited July 27, 2012 by Isaac

[Josh T 0]

I agree that the B772 is still a very good plane. MAS simply needs to refurbish them properly to the same standard as the current A33E and the A380.

[KK Lee 5]

His response was that the Airbus then (they asked him why he ordered B737s instead of A320s) was a "paper aeroplane" and British Airways will only consider the plane once it was up and flying, like the proven B737 was.

 

I think people like Azran and AJ should do well to remember those comments. The manufacturers can promise the earth and the sun. At the end of the day, the airlines will be the ones who are stuck with under performing planes and uneconomic operations! Azran must be very happy he only leased the A343s and not own them. Airlines like Thai are now stuck with the A345s and A346s, which are not as economic to operate as the B77Ws.

 

As if engineers are useless in calculation and designing

[S V Choong 4]

It was already a known fact that the 343 is not as economical to operate compared to the 772 back when Air Canada retired and transferred some of their 343 to D7. I suppose D7 was just very aggressive then and couldn't wait any longer, so they opted for the 343. Read on A.net that the aircraft lease is a lot cheaper for the 343 than 772, so that played a big factor In D7 to get the 343 instead or the 772. Besides, there just weren't many 772 available in the market then... well, not even now.

 

There are a few 777-200 non-ER ones on the market but presumably nobody wants them? As for the 777-200ER...... I guess they can knock on their door as SQ retires them pretty soonish

[Isaac 0]

I agree that the B772 is still a very good plane. MAS simply needs to refurbish them properly to the same standard as the current A33E and the A380.

And if they do, hopefully they won't make the same mistake as they did with their new 333 and 388. Talking about J here

 

 

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There are a few 777-200 non-ER ones on the market but presumably nobody wants them?

CX has been unsuccessful in offloading their non-ER 772. But then, the main reason nobody wants them is because their 772 has small cargo doors.

 

 

As for the 777-200ER...... I guess they can knock on their door as SQ retires them pretty soonish

It seems that SIA will continue to operate the 772 for quite sometime as they are not getting their 789 or 389 anytime soon. They still have more than 30x 772 and the recently ordered 15x 333 will replace only half of the 772.

[nrazmoor 0]

As if engineers are useless in calculation and designing

 

Sometimes its not about the engineers but more on their sales team which promises something that even the engineers raised their eyebrow...

Edited July 27, 2012 by nrazmoor

[KK Lee 5]

Sometimes its not about the engineers but more on their sales team which promises something that even the engineers raised their eyebrow...

 

Some forgot simulators, buildings are designed and built by engineers, and everything start from a piece of paper or virtual.

[S V Choong 4]

Some forgot simulators, buildings are designed and built by engineers, and everything start from a piece of paper or virtual.\

 

Correction: Buildings are not designed by engineers. They are mostly designed by architects and engineers only involved in structural input.

 

Everything starts from paper / virtual. Whether it will meet the performance is another story. This is true even buildings are not functioning as they designed to be. Take for example sustainable design and rating in buildings. It is designed to be certain number of Greenstars or LEEDS. The actual performance after the building has been build varies slightly. Sometimes the difference can be cut throat, especially if they depend on the economics and value management. It will cause them to lose the rating even with a small bit of difference.

[nrazmoor 0]

Airbus to raise A330 take-off weight and fuel capacity

 

Airbus is further hiking the maximum take-off weight of the A330, raising it to 242t, and will offer a higher fuel capacity option for the larger A330-300 variant.

The airframer had previously disclosed plans to increase the twinjet's take-off weight to 240t.

Airbus's latest enhancements will extend the range of the A330-300 by 500nm (930km) over the 235t model, and by 350nm for the 238t A330-200 at full passenger load.

It will give operators of the -300 the option of activating the centre wing fuel tank, a standard feature on the longer-range -200 but one which has remained unused on the larger aircraft.

This will increase the -300's fuel capacity from 97,500 litres to more than 139,000 litres. The modification will include tank inerting.

Airbus hopes the improvements will extend the A330-300's range to 6,100nm by 2015, enabling it to perform westbound flights from south-east Asia to Europe.

 

 

http://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/airbus-to-raise-a330-take-off-weight-and-fuel-capacity-379583/

 

 

So will MH buy this one and retired their 777??

[BC Tam 2]

So will MH buy this one and retired their 777??

Heck why not ?

Now that sugar-daddy has waddled in with wads of cash (3B+ I understand)

[JingKai Seah 0]

Heck why not ?

Now that sugar-daddy has waddled in with wads of cash (3B+ I understand)

Hmm.. but 6100nm is still not long enough compared to 777-300ERs or 777-200ERs/LRs right? and furthermore, 777 seating capacity is much much larger than A333 right? at least, thats the info I get from wikipedia when i compared both A330 and B777

[flee 5]

Airbus offers new 242 tonne A330 takeoff-weight capability to extend market coverage

• 242 tonne option increases revenue payload on longer missions
• Extra fuel capacity extends range by around 500nm at full passenger payload
• Opening new direct flights with A330-300s between South-East Asia and Europe
  

29 NOVEMBER 2012
Airbus has improved the A330-300 and A330-200 even further by providing operators both with a 242 metric tonne maximum take-off weight (MTOW) capability and, for the larger A330-300, an increased fuel capacity option. These enhancements build on the capability announced earlier this year for an increased 240 tonne MTOW, and will be available for operators in 2015.

The new take-off weight capability combined with the fuel capacity increase enables operators of these new A330-300s to carry additional payload on longer missions. Overall, the full payload range now increases by around 500nm over today’s 235 tonne A330-300, and by around 350nm over today’s 238 tonne A330-200.

The A330-300’s optional fuel capacity increase will be achieved by activating the centre wing tank for the first time on this model. The centre tank and its associated systems have always been present as standard on its longer-range sibling – the A330-200. The additional fuel capacity for the A330-300 allows operators to fly new longer distance routes, such as direct flights between South-East Asia and Europe. For example, it will permit westbound direct flights such as Kuala Lumpur to Frankfurt or Paris, with the ability to carry additional cargo on the eastbound return flight.

Head of the A330 programme Patrick Piedrafita commented: “The A330 is already a highly efficient and reliable airliner and we have taken it as our duty to maximise this even further, along with range and payload increases.” He added: “We are currently delivering more A330s per month than ever before, and this is set to continue, especially given the ongoing improvements we are introducing to the airframe, cabin interior, and engines.”

The A330 Family, which spans 250 to 300 seats, and includes Freighter, VIP, and Military Transport/Tanker variants, has now attracted more than 1,200 orders and around 900 aircraft are flying worldwide. Ever since the original version of the A330-300 entered service, the hallmark has been its very efficient operating economics. Thanks to the introduction of numerous product improvements, it remains the most cost-efficient and capable aircraft in its class and the Family is achieving average dispatch reliability above 99 percent. With headquarters in Toulouse, France, Airbus is an EADS company.

 

Source: http://www.airbus.com/newsevents/news-events-single/detail/airbus-offers-new-242-tonne-a330-takeoff-weight-capability-to-extend-market-coverage/

[Lock SH 0]

Hmm.. but 6100nm is still not long enough compared to 777-300ERs or 777-200ERs/LRs right? and furthermore, 777 seating capacity is much much larger than A333 right? at least, thats the info I get from wikipedia when i compared both A330 and B777

6100nm may not be comparable to 300ER/200LR but each aircraft was designed for a purpose. For a 'thin' sector from SEA to EU, it is good enough. A330 was designed to carry 40 tons payload for a max range and if an operator could maximise that performance, then it is a money making machine.

 

 

[nrazmoor 0]

Correct me if im wrong..., but with 6100nm its enough for MH to do KUL- MAD/BER/DME/HEL and even if they start thinking of NRT-JFK sector. There is no point of having aircraft with longer range unless you can optimise and use the extra miles

Edited November 29, 2012 by nrazmoor

[Sharil Abdul Rahman 0]

Interesting that they use KL as their mentioned example for the press release.

 

subliminal messaging to D7/MH?

[flee 5]

Interesting that they use KL as their mentioned example for the press release.

 

subliminal messaging to D7/MH?

I think it is more targetted at MH because their current A333 order will be fulfilled before the upgraded MTOW version becomes available.

 

As for D7, they can switch to the new version for their 2015 and later deliveries. However, D7 is not looking to operate to the EU unless the ETS and airport tax issues are more in line with their target cost numbers.

 

This upgrade of the A333 is probably indicating that Airbus is not going to stand still now that the B787-8 is coming on stream. It intends to compete as long as it can. It may also signal that the A350 could potentially face further delays. It could also mean that they might cancel the A350-800.

Edited November 30, 2012 by flee

[Sandeep G 1]

Now if only they could get the thing to fly faster!

 

--Boeing. Overtaking Airbus' on the airways since 1972.

[Johan Z 0]

MH also has 10 options for A330. They either exercise these options for more A330 or get new A350.

[flee 5]

MH also has 10 options for A330. They either exercise these options for more A330 or get new A350.

Perhaps they will use those options to get the B772 replacements.

[alberttky 0]

Airbus A330-300 direct flights from South East Asia to Europe should be possible with the additional fuel capacity that is scheduled to become available on new aircraft from 2015. The increased volume is expected to permit non-stop westbound flights of up to 6,100nm, permitting the model to be flown on routes such as Kuala Lumpur-Frankfurt or -Paris. On eastbound flights the change could be used to carry additional cargo.

 

The improved performance arises from a heavier, 242,000kg maximum take-off weight (MTOW) for A330-300s and A330-200s, with the former variant also being offered with an increased fuel-capacity option. This increases the 240,000kg MTOW announced earlier this year, for which lessor CIT is the launch customer.

 

Airbus says that, combined with the higher fuel capacity, the new take-off weight will enable A330-300 operators to carry additional payload on longer missions. "Overall, the full payload range now increases by around 500nm over today’s 235,000kg [aircraft], and by around 350nm over [the current] 238,000kg A330-200."

 

The new optional higher fuel capacity on the A330-300 is derived by activation of the centre wing tank for the first time on this model. "The centre tank and its associated systems have always been standard on its longer-range [A330-200] sibling," says the manufacturer.

 

Earlier in 2012, Airbus unveiled plans to increase A330 MTOW to 240,000kg. The centre wing tank is standard fit on the longer-range Series 200 but until now has not been used on the bigger A330-300, for which fuel capacity increases from 97,500 litres to almost 140,000 litres.

 

In addition to increased range and payload, the type is set to receive aerodynamic performance enhancements through improvements to the airframe, cabin interior, and engines, says A330 programme chief Patrick Piedrafita.

 

Modifications include reduced-length flap-track "canoe" fairings and reshaped inboard leading-edge slats and fully exploiting the A330 wing's "load-alleviation" function. The manufacturer plans to reinforce areas of the wing and fuselage.– Ian Goold

 

http://www.asianaviation.com/articles/365/Heavier-Airbus-A330s-will-offer-Kuala-Lumpur-Paris-or-Frankfurt-range

[Mohd Suhaimi Fariz 2]

So will this be the 777-200 replacement?

Edited December 12, 2012 by Mohd Suhaimi Fariz