Bye bye to the RMAF MIG29N

[Fizree Helmi 0]

So The US didn’t restricted RMAF F-18D function? What Rakyat was told by the ex-pm was a lie?

 

 

 

Don't think so. Base on what I hear, TUDM F/A-18D can't even lock on to fire on any US allied planes. Plus do you really think that US DOD will give TUDM the same spec as the USAF/USN/USMC F/A-18D(even it is a delivery mistake). Malaysian military critics said that TUDM F/A-18D are 5-10 times downgrade then the a/c of USAF/USN/USMC.

 

The only reason why TUDM acquired that a/c was the "all weather ground attack capability". That is why only 8 a/c are in service with TUDM not 18 a/c like MIG-29N and SU-30MKM.

[KK Lee 5]

Don't think so. Base on what I hear, TUDM F/A-18D can't even lock on to fire on any US allied planes. Plus do you really think that US DOD will give TUDM the same spec as the USAF/USN/USMC F/A-18D(even it is a delivery mistake). Malaysian military critics said that TUDM F/A-18D are 5-10 times downgrade then the a/c of USAF/USN/USMC.

 

The only reason why TUDM acquired that a/c was the "all weather ground attack capability". That is why only 8 a/c are in service with TUDM not 18 a/c like MIG-29N and SU-30MKM.

 

Why RMAF wanted to target USAF? Can RMAF Mig-29 and SU-30 target at Russian? It is the function of IFF to prevent friendly fire. With the exception of nuclear capability, what other function RMAF want A/F-18D to have? If RMAF A/F-18D is 5-10 times downgrade then the a/c of USAF/USN/USMC, mean it is equivalent to F-5E? Why RMAF still bought them, other ground attack aircraft not available? With RMAF armory, A/F-18D is formidable air to air, why restricted to air to ground only?

 

Edited November 1, 2009 by KK Lee

[Fizree Helmi 0]

Why RMAF wanted to target USAF? Can RMAF Mig-29 and SU-30 target at Russian? It is the function of IFF to prevent friendly fire. With the exception of nuclear capability, what other function RMAF want A/F-18D to have? If RMAF A/F-18D is 5-10 times downgrade then the a/c of USAF/USN/USMC, mean it is equivalent to F-5E? Why RMAF still bought them, other ground attack aircraft not available? With RMAF armory, A/F-18D is formidable air to air, why restricted to air to ground only?

 

 

Yes, there is no reason why RMAF wanted to target USAF but "if" we are at war with US or any US allied, TUDM F/A-18D can't shoot any of the planes.

 

F-5E and F/A-18D is totally 2 different. Even with downgrade version, F/A-18D is much more better version then those F-5E.

 

I did not said that TUDM F/A-18D is restricted to air to ground only. True, F/A-18 is a formidable air to air fighter a/c, but the D model is primarily operated in the night attack and FAC (Forward Air Controller) roles.

[KK Lee 5]

Countries go to war over resources and in the name of religion. Unless Malaysia is hostile to the US, US don’t have interest or intention to have conflict with Malaysia else UD DoD and States Department won’t had approved the sales of A/F-18D to RMAF. Strategically, Malaysia is more likely to have conflict with Indonesia, Thailand, Philippine and China.

 

Isn’t the IFF function is to prevent friendly fire? After Iran F-14, it would be foolish for the US not to safe guard against friend turned enemy.

 

[Fizree Helmi 0]

Countries go to war over resources and in the name of religion. Unless Malaysia is hostile to the US, US don’t have interest or intention to have conflict with Malaysia else UD DoD and States Department won’t had approved the sales of A/F-18D to RMAF. Strategically, Malaysia is more likely to have conflict with Indonesia, Thailand, Philippine and China.

 

Isn’t the IFF function is to prevent friendly fire? After Iran F-14, it would be foolish for the US not to safe guard against friend turned enemy.

 

 

I know that Malaysia and US is in a good term right now. If not, there won't be an airshow by the famous Thunderbird of the USAF. That why I've wrote "IF".

 

If I'm wrong, please correct my statement, an a/c with IFF is identity by code number right? Each code number is represent for either military or civilian a/c, type of a/c and country of origin of the a/c. So if IFF is an US allied a/c, eg thailand, will the missile on board TUDM F/A-18D fire even if we do have conflict with them?

[Sandeep G 1]

Why should the US sell hardware to the RMAF/ATM when they are selling bucket loads to Singapore? Has anyone thought that perhaps the picture painted to the politicians is that it is 'more likely' for a conflict between Malaysia and Singapore?

[KK Lee 5]

There isn’t any resource in Singapore that interest us or worth scarify life for. However, as Singapore is a small dot on the map and “Only the insecure strive for security”, hence Singapore is armed to the teeth.

 

Among Singapore allies, US is the strongest and has vast interest in Singapore. It is natural for Singapore to purchase majority of weapons from the U.S.

 

Many people neglect the fact that Malaysia and Singapore are members of Five Power Defence Agreement. Declaring war on one is to fight the whole pact.

 

 

[Fitri Shukri 0]

There isn’t any resource in Singapore that interest us or worth scarify life for. However, as Singapore is a small dot on the map and “Only the insecure strive for security”, hence Singapore is armed to the teeth.

 

Among Singapore allies, US is the strongest and has vast interest in Singapore. It is natural for Singapore to purchase majority of weapons from the U.S.

 

Many people neglect the fact that Malaysia and Singapore are members of Five Power Defence Agreement. Declaring war on one is to fight the whole pact.

 

 

 

Agree with KK Lee. In fact, the FPDA should be extended to East Malaysia (and possibly include the tiny Brunei Armed Forces too). There are bigger potential threats 'out there', and FPDA can, to a certain point, become a balance of power in this region.

 

As for defence equipment and system, we need a better military and paramilitary systems for monitoring our maritime borders against pirates, illigal immigrant and arms smuglers. This is no job for high powered fighter aircraft but more for maritime patrol aircraft, helicopters, maritime radars and high speed-long endurance boats.

[Mohd. Helmi 0]

There isn’t any resource in Singapore that interest us or worth scarify life for. However, as Singapore is a small dot on the map and “Only the insecure strive for security”, hence Singapore is armed to the teeth.

 

Among Singapore allies, US is the strongest and has vast interest in Singapore. It is natural for Singapore to purchase majority of weapons from the U.S.

 

Many people neglect the fact that Malaysia and Singapore are members of Five Power Defence Agreement. Declaring war on one is to fight the whole pact.

 

 

 

 

Disagree, it's not declaring war on one, is to fight the whole pack like you said.

 

FPDA, is not like the Anglo-Malayan defence agreement (AMDA) that it replaced, which guarantees that the UK/NZ/Aus will come to protect us, which they did during the Indo confrontation, communist insurgency. The FPDA did not impose any "undue strain or obligation on any party". The only upshot was the FPDA: a set of arrangements, obliged all parties to immediately consult each other in the event of any external aggression or threat of attack against either Malaysia or Singapore "for the purpose of deciding what measures should be taken jointly or separately in relation to such an attack or threat". These arrangements stood in "sharp contrast to the defence guarantees that AMDA embodied"

 

So it's just consultations between the parties not legally binding to act in defense of, but why the FPDA remains relevant even after the cold war, megalomaniac Sukarno and in these modern times is because it does provide joint training, technical expertise sharing amongst the countries. I believe RMAF Butterworth still has RAAF, RAF and RSAF personnel there. The RAAF used to have 2 fighter squadrons stationed at Butterworth.

 

At the end of the day, we've got to protect ourselves.. I however suggest we have a stronger defense agreement, with guarantees like the AMDA, we should have it with Singapore. We do so much business with each other, blood ties, we should be best of friends.. have a "special relationship" like the brits have with the yanks.

 

Agree with KK Lee. In fact, the FPDA should be extended to East Malaysia (and possibly include the tiny Brunei Armed Forces too). There are bigger potential threats 'out there', and FPDA can, to a certain point, become a balance of power in this region.

 

As for defence equipment and system, we need a better military and paramilitary systems for monitoring our maritime borders against pirates, illigal immigrant and arms smuglers. This is no job for high powered fighter aircraft but more for maritime patrol aircraft, helicopters, maritime radars and high speed-long endurance boats.

 

FPDA does cover East Malaysia, since last I checked, Sabah and Sarawak were an integral part of our country. Brunei Armed Forces, hmm.. think we should leave the Sultan alone with his little fiefdom.

[KK Lee 5]

Believe FPDA was not explicit was to avoid rival block been established in the region. However, having Integrated Air Defence System under the command of Australian was a direct involvement by default.

 

Like Nato, deterrent is the name of the game.

 

[Waiping 12]

Ahem, if we are not going down south, maybe up north?

 

Just an opinion.

[KK Lee 5]

Ahem, if we are not going down south, maybe up north?

 

Just an opinion.

 

Brunei? Oooops! We have given them reason in keeping a British Gurkha battalion

 

[Waiping 12]

Brunei? Oooops! We have given them reason in keeping a British Gurkha battalion

 

 

Those equipment that we are getting not based in East Malaysia.

[leon t 0]

something is really amiss here - where does any country that buys a fighter jets and use it for only 10 years? and how was the purchasing process and evaluation in the very first place? Shouldnt RMAF knows about the "high" costs of maintenance when it assesses and evaluate the MIG-29s? In many countries, fighter planes have been operated much more than just 10 short years - even the USAF F15s have been in ops for nearly 23 years! And am sure, India's russian fighters have served more than 10 years. Eevn down south, their F16s are already over 10 years and their F-5s are more than 25 years. There must be something or some agendas for buying these MIGs in the veryu first place and some people must be very fifthy rich for buying these planes.

[BC Tam 2]

Hold on to your horses folks, dah-man has just delivered this !

 

Dr M wants Najib to keep MiG-29s

By Leslie Lau

Consultant Editor

 

KUALA LUMPUR, Dec 28 – Tun Dr Mahathir Mohamad has attacked the Najib administration’s decision to replace the country’s MiG-29N jet fighters as a waste of money, in remarks that will add to pressure on the prime minister who is still dealing with the embarrassing discovery that two air force jet engines had been stolen.

 

Dr Mahathir, who was a trenchant critic of former PM Tun Abdullah Badawi, did not mention Datuk Seri Najib Razak but he questioned the need to replace the MiG-29Ns which were acquired when he was still the prime minister.

 

“If I am not mistaken, the aircraft are less than 20 years old. There are many countries, including India, using this aircraft. Are they not able to use the MiG-29 after 20 years? Have they also condemned their MiGs as early as this?” asked Dr Mahathir in a posting on his blog today.

 

Malaysia received the delivery of the Russian-made MiG-29N in April 1995. Malaysia had signed the purchase of 18 units of the aircraft in June 1994 at a cost of US$380 million, with training and spare parts taking the overall package to US$1.6 billion.

 

About the same time, Malaysia also acquired eight F/A 18D Hornets from the United States.

 

Earlier this year, Defence Minister Datuk Seri Ahmad Zahid Hamidi had said that the air force’s MiG-29N jetfighters would be sold off and replaced with new aircraft.

 

Several companies abroad had expressed interest to buy the aircraft, he said, adding that the ministry would discuss the matter with the Finance Ministry.

 

Ahmad Zahid said the MiG-29N would be replaced with interceptors with the latest technologies to strengthen the air force’s capabilities.

 

Dr Mahathir implied today that the Najib administration had been influenced by middlemen looking for huge commissions in its decision to replace the Russian fighters.

 

“The sale and acquisition of aircraft by the government can give millions in profits to middlemen. Are the interests of middlemen influencing the decision to condemn the MiG-29 and buy new replacements?” he asked.

 

Dr Mahathir said that with the country’s current economic conditions, he wondered whether the government could afford new acquisitions. He argued that the MiG-29Ns should actually be refurbished as that would be more cost-effective.

 

“Can’t we repair the MiG-29s? If we cannot, the Russians can. Maybe even the Indians can.

 

“If fighter jets costing hundreds of millions can only last 20 years it is better that we do not have fighter aircraft,” he said.

 

Dr Mahathir’s remarks calling for the government to save money and cancel its plan to replace the Russian-made fighters comes amid charges made in a recently published book that he had squandered huge sums of public funds when he was Prime Minister.

 

Dr Mahathir has denied the charges that he had wasted nearly RM100 billion through corruption and grandiose projects which were detailed in “Malaysian Maverick: Mahathir Mohamad in Turbulent Times,” a book written by Barry Wain, the former managing editor of the Asian Wall Street Journal.

 

from here

[Tamizi Hj Tamby 1]

Hmm,what a news.

[flee 5]

MiG-29s to fly on for a while more

 

KUANTAN: The MiG-29N jet fighters will not be grounded as initially planned but will be used for at least another five years.

 

Defence Minister Datuk Seri Dr Ahmad Zahid Hamidi said the earlier plan was to decommission the aircraft and sell them to Third World countries.

 

However, after taking into consideration the current economic situation, the Government decided to shelve that plan, he said.

 

”We have decided to continue using 10 of the 16 MiG-29N jet fighters after sending them for repairs and upgrading,” he said.

 

Six of the aircraft have already been decommissioned, Bernama reported.

 

”We will call in experts from Aerospace Technology System Corp to do the necessary repairs and overhaul of the engines so that it would be safe for them to fly again,” he told reporters during a visit to the Royal Malaysian Air Force base here on Tuesday.

 

Zahid said the plan to purchase new “multi-role combat aircraft” had to be put on hold because of the unfavourable economic climate presently.

 

He said the ministry’s decision also took into account the views of former prime minister Tun Dr Mahathir Mohamad, who in his blog said he felt that the MiG jet fighters should be retained.

 

”Initially, our plan was to ground the jets and sell them to Third World countries. However, we must also study our financial position.

 

”Perhaps over the next five years, after the global economy shows signs of recovery, we may be able to proceed with the plan,” he said.

 

Last June, the ministry had announced a plan to decommission the MiG jets because of costly maintainence and repairs which amounted to some RM260mil annually.

 

They were supposed to be replaced by 18 newly-acquired Sukhoi jets.

 

The MiG jet fighters came into service in April 1995 at a cost of RM1.3bil but required regular maintenance amounting RM10mil each, in addition to engine overhauls at a cost of RM7mil every year.

 

Source: http://www.thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=/2010/2/23/nation/20100223172648&sec=nation

[Waiping 12]

There isn't much cash left so this project postpone lah.

[Sandeep G 1]

Yet another flip-flop decision by the gahmen.... these fellas all wearing the blue bata or famous tat-sing brand???!! idiots.....

[Mohd Idham 0]

If they grounded those Migs, 'somebody' will loose contract, 'somebody' will loose money, 'somebody' will loose commission....in the 'air'....so they want to grab as much as possible before everythings stops...they said 5 years more because it is still 'reliable'...

 

Those guys are very stupid...people can sense what they are doing...how 1d10t they are...come out on television, pretending this and that...1d10t...bulls**t everything...

 

.

Edited February 24, 2010 by Mohd Idham

[Waiping 12]

5 years. When is the next GE?

[KK Lee 5]

In countries like USA, Australia, UK, etc, MoD/DoD review threat strategically every few years, published most in white papers and arms is procured to meet identified threat. However, arms procurement in this country is like hobby, procured in the interest of few and whenever budget allowed

 

Dr. M is a ex-PM and not even a MP. If MinDef takes Dr M’s view before making decision means Dr. M is above the parliament and more powerful than the whole cabinet, PM and Mrs PM

 

Wonder when will Dr M cross sword with Mrs PM

 

[Azrin A 2]

MiG-29s to fly on for a while more

 

snip .. snip

 

However, after taking into consideration the current economic situation, the Government decided to shelve that plan, he said.

 

”We have decided to continue using 10 of the 16 MiG-29N jet fighters after sending them for repairs and upgrading,” he said.

 

snip .. snip

 

Source: http://www.thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=/2010/2/23/nation/20100223172648&sec=nation

 

Heheh .. suddenly I remember the F5E

[Ashmil Abd Ghani 0]

So MiG replacement will take place, at least, under 11th Malaysia Plan...

 

I believe 1 thing in this current running govt, they running out of $$$...The budget deficit will get wider with such expenses...Hope the 4% (?) GST can cover some fee on MiG replacement programme...

[iwan 3]

politics aside,its a good thing that we continue operating the MiGs..how are we going to defend the country with just 18 sukhois and a few hornets?

 

according to the NST yesterday,they mentioned something about 2 Su-30MkMs grounded because of FOD and high cost of maintainence..are they already facing problems with the sukhois?