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Mohd Azizul Ramli

MAB Cabin Crew Reduction on All Flights

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Yet another rumour popped up! Don't we just love this sensational news?

 

From a fellow MalaysianWinger, Mahmoud, I was told that MH is to reduce one cabin staff in Economy Class throughout the entire B734 fleets. Reason being is of course, to cut cost in line with MH's infamous new vision in becomming 'A 5 Star Carrier with LCCs Cost.'

 

From what I gathered, cabin staff (crew) can be categorised in 8 categories:

 

Category:

1 - IFS/IFSS

2 - CS/CSS

3 - LS/LSS

4 - WB/NB Flight Steward

5 - WB Flight Stewardess

6 - WB Flight Stewardess

7 - NB Flight Stewardess

8 - NB Flight Stewardess

 

Legends:

IFS/IFSS - Inflight Supervisor

CS/CSS - Chief Steward/Stewardess

LS/LSS - Leading Steward/Stewardess

FS/FSS - Flight Steward/Stewardess

NB - Narrowbody

WB - Widebody

 

As for MH, the minimum cabin crew requirements are as follows:

 

F50 = 02

B734 = 04

A330 = 08

B772 = 08

B744 = 12

 

I am not sure about the industry standard or what IATA has underlined about this matter but, based on my discussions with fellow A.Netter Isz1, DCA and MCAR 1996 requires a B737 (which is defined as an aircraft with total seating not exceeding 200 = 1 cabin crew per 50 pax), the minimum crew requirement is 3 cabin crew. As for comparison, AirAsia follows this minimum requirement (3 cabin crew for 180 odd passengers, or a ratio of crew to passenger of 1:60). MH on the other hand, have 5 cabin crew onboard B734s (3 in Economy, 1 in Golden Club and 1 Flight Supervisor).

 

By pulling out of one cabin crew in all B734s' Economy class, service efficiencies and safety issues will arise. Reducing the number of cabin staff from 3 to 2 in Economy class will increase the ratio of cabin staff to passengers from 1:43 (3 cabin staff for 128 Economy passengers) to 1:64 (2 cabin staff for 128 Economy passengers) thus, not following the 1:50 ratio recommended by DCA and MCAR 1996. Delivery speed will reduce as each cabin staff has to serve more passengers for inflight services and safety concern will increase during emergency procedures.

 

Presently (before this idea came up), MH's Flight Safety and Human Factors Department always believe that 1 or 2 "extra" cabin attendant (or assist crew) onboard any given aircraft may actually help during emergency cases if 1 or 2 primary crew goes 'down'. Primary crew refer to those who is responsible for their respective main exit/door and safety equipments onboard the aircraft. The assist crew will take over the primary crew tasks (if only primary crew goes 'down'). Other than that, the duties of assist crew varies from firefighting to first aid.

 

However, in my opinion, MH's management will still proceed with this idea because:

 

- To improve cabin staff productivities and at the same time to help trimming the number of staff to favourable level as we are all aware that MH is overstaffed. When the number of staff is reduced, more costs can be saved in salaries and allowances and a proper perks for well performed staff can be laid down.

 

- As for the concern for safety, I think given MH's excellent safety record, this aspect (unfortunately) can be overlooked.

 

Therefore, cutbacks in cabin staff is inevitable. For the record, MH HAS REDUCED the number of cabin crew onboard B772 from 12 to 11 circa July 2007 recently.

 

Another relating issue pops up. Will this development leading to more Malaysian staff leaving the national carrier for others? Again, for the record, in line with the cost cutting measure, MH have employed a new batch of Argentinean and South African cabin crew as well as some Australian pilots (MAYBE) because the salaries that they asked is much lower. Most of the Malaysian pilots left MH for EK, EY and QR.

 

Any thoughts my friends?

 

Azizul

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Herm, if this is really the case, the morale among their staff will be dropping drastically, since their company is the one that do not loyal to their employee. For the long run, this will bring MAS to yet another big problem.

 

I'm not saying the reduce in FA itself, but overall, for long term.

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I suppose the standard or the guidelines uses the Cabin Crew / Total pax on the aircraft for calculation, MH cut down one crew in Y cabin simply due to the snackbox can be handed out faster compared to handing out a tray of meal, for safety concern i have no comment thou. AK have 4 Cabin Crew on their 180 seater A320 :)

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i think it better to reduce one OR two cabin staff. before this, i have seen the are many cabin crew 'duduk saja'.

meanwhile, i suggest that MH should reduce one staff who on duty at the departure gate. For example when i travel from

PEN-KUL last 2 month, there are 5 MH staff at departure gate!!!!! begitu banyak maaaa!!!!! Look AK, they have only 2 staff at departure gate

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i think it better to reduce one OR two cabin staff. before this, i have seen the are many cabin crew 'duduk saja'.

meanwhile, i suggest that MH should reduce one staff who on duty at the departure gate. For example when i travel from

PEN-KUL last 2 month, there are 5 MH staff at departure gate!!!!! begitu banyak maaaa!!!!! Look AK, they have only 2 staff at departure gate

 

Ha - reminds me of TG where there are 6 lounge staff manning one reception desk. One or two doing actual work, the rest doing stuff all.

 

But in all seriousness, depending on the flight - you do need about 5-6 gate agents for a jumbo, maybe less for smaller planes with lighter loads.

Airlines in the US only have about 2 GAs per flight regardless of the load, but when something goes wrong (weather, technical issues etc) causing misconnects for lots of people - it's CHAOS at the gate...

 

As for FAs, SQ also recently reduced the number of FAs onboard their 2 class 777s.

And btw, if you're ever on a QF 744 and wonder why they don't respond to you in the middle of meal service in Y or are taking so long to serve - they only have 6 FAs for the whole of Y! :blink:

Edited by Keith T

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As for comparison, AirAsia follows this minimum requirement (3 cabin crew for 180 odd passengers, or a ratio of crew to passenger of 1:60).

AK have 4 Cabin Crew on their 180 seater A320 :)

I supposed, 3 cabin crew and 1 inflight supervisor in AK? Never fly with them. I think that's the composition that they have in Indonesian LCCs here.

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I supposed, 3 cabin crew and 1 inflight supervisor in AK? Never fly with them. I think that's the composition that they have in Indonesian LCCs here.

 

In this case, maybe the definition of Cabin crew to you differs. Flight crews usually split to FlightDeck Crew (the pilots) and Cabin Crew (the stewardess). Where Leading/Supervisors are also considered a Cabin Crew. As for AK, yes, they have a Leading / Supervisor and 3 steward/stewardess on board their A320.

 

My 2 Cent. Correct me if i am wrong

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In this case, maybe the definition of Cabin crew to you differs. Flight crews usually split to FlightDeck Crew (the pilots) and Cabin Crew (the stewardess). Where Leading/Supervisors are also considered a Cabin Crew. As for AK, yes, they have a Leading / Supervisor and 3 steward/stewardess on board their A320.

 

My 2 Cent. Correct me if i am wrong

 

You're right there. Whatever they're called they're still cabin crew - just different ranks and maybe duties. The Inflight Supervisor/Cabin Services Manager/Cabin Services Director/whatever will be primarily concerned with paperwork, meet and greet top tier elite pax and VIP - and they sometimes help out with service when they're free and an extra pair of hands is needed. They're also the only member of the cabin crew with the power to abort a take off due to an unsecured cabin. Some airlines will have a Purser in charge of service for each cabin, or a crew member with such a function but with a different name.

 

It's like on the flight deck you have a Captain, First Officer, Second Officer etc.

Edited by Keith T

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By pulling out of one cabin crew in all B734s' Economy class, service efficiencies and safety issues will arise. Reducing the number of cabin staff from 3 to 2 in Economy class will increase the ratio of cabin staff to passengers from 1:43 (3 cabin staff for 128 Economy passengers) to 1:64 (2 cabin staff for 128 Economy passengers) thus, not following the 1:50 ratio recommended by DCA and MCAR 1996. Delivery speed will reduce as each cabin staff has to serve more passengers for inflight services and safety concern will increase during emergency procedures.

They are not counting it like this, Zul. In fact MAS is not violating any rule if they have only THREE cabin crew on their 734. MAS 734 have 144 seats > 1:48.

 

It seems to be MAS want to copy the US/EU airlines huh ?

Northwest Airlines

- 320 > 3 crew/4 crew on longer flight

- 319 > 3 crew

 

(please note that they are 16 domestic first class seats on NWA 32S)

 

QF have only 14 cabin crew on their 744 (in year 2005).

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very simple,

 

u wanna offer me meal box or u wanna give me 4 cabin crews on 734, i have no problem with that!!

 

BUT GIMME AK FARES!!!! <_>

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QF have only 14 cabin crew on their 744 (in year 2005).

 

Which is why the meal service in QF Y can be VERY slow. And the crew call button during those times becomes an 'ignore button.'

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They are not counting it like this, Zul. In fact MAS is not violating any rule if they have only THREE cabin crew on their 734. MAS 734 have 144 seats > 1:48.

But does it precise to calculate it like that? MH's B734s are consist of 16 Golden Club seats and 128 Economy class seats (thus the total of 144 seats in the whole aircraft). I don't think it is precise to calculate the ratio based on the total seats divided by the total number of cabin staff (144/4 = 1:36 before 'rumour' and 144/3 = 1:48 after 'rumour').

 

3 cabin staff are assigned in Economy class while 1 cabin staff in Golden Club class. The inflight supervisor, as mentioned above will oversee and help whenever necessary. The duties of the cabin staff are not interchangeable, meaning one cannot simply switch between serving the Economy class and then the Golden Club class in one particular flight. Therefore, I think it is more precise to calculate the ratio based on the actual number of passengers the cabin staff have to attend, i.e. 1:16 for Golden Club class and 1:43 (128/3) for Economy class.

 

Am I in the correct or the wrong path?

Edited by Mohd Azizul Ramli

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The duties of the cabin staff are not interchangeable, meaning one cannot simply switch between serving the Economy class and then the Golden Club class in one particular flight.

 

Might not apply for MH - but on SQ, when they're done serving J, some of the crew will head back to Y to help out with the meal service there.

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Might not apply for MH - but on SQ, when they're done serving J, some of the crew will head back to Y to help out with the meal service there.

 

 

I think the reason they help out is because they have more than 1 FA in J of SQ, while MH's J class has only 1 FA. That's why they can't help back there...

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I think the reason they help out is because they have more than 1 FA in J of SQ, while MH's J class has only 1 FA. That's why they can't help back there...

 

Forgot about that for the 734 - good point. :)

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They only hv one in J? I always see more than 2 sumtimes the cabin itself too crowded with the stewardess!

Edited by Seth K

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They only hv one in J? I always see more than 2 sumtimes the cabin itself too crowded with the stewardess!

 

Trying to recall my recent (ie last Saturday) KUL-SIN experience on the 734...

I was sitting at the back of the plane (a very helpful check in agent blocked out the whole row for me :drinks: ), and there was one FA for the entire back section it seems. There must be another 1-2 FAs serving the rest of YCL.

I also recalled 2 FAs pulling a trolley, and eventually disappearing into the F (well, J for all intents and purposes) cabin - so now I think about it there must be 2 FAs in there, unless one of them was serving the front of YCL from the same trolley.

Can't really remember much else about the flight as I was tired from the previous night and so spent most of the short flight snoozing. :pardon:

Edited by Keith T

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But does it precise to calculate it like that? MH's B734s are consist of 16 Golden Club seats and 128 Economy class seats (thus the total of 144 seats in the whole aircraft). I don't think it is precise to calculate the ratio based on the total seats divided by the total number of cabin staff (144/4 = 1:36 before 'rumour' and 144/3 = 1:48 after 'rumour').

I was referring to your earlier post (shown below). They are calculating the whole seats available in the aircraft. Not just one particular class of the aircraft.

By pulling out of one cabin crew in all B734s' Economy class, service efficiencies and safety issues will arise. Reducing the number of cabin staff from 3 to 2 in Economy class will increase the ratio of cabin staff to passengers from 1:43 (3 cabin staff for 128 Economy passengers) to 1:64 (2 cabin staff for 128 Economy passengers) thus, not following the 1:50 ratio recommended by DCA and MCAR 1996. Delivery speed will reduce as each cabin staff has to serve more passengers for inflight services and safety concern will increase during emergency procedures.

We'll take Northwest Airlines Airbus A320-200 for example. All NWA 320 are configured with 148 seats (Domestic F - 16, Y - 132) and only 3 cabin crew are assigned to work on the type. Since MAS seems to fancy the US/EU carriers operating method a lot, they might as well copy this B) :rolleyes:

 

 

3 cabin staff are assigned in Economy class while 1 cabin staff in Golden Club class. The inflight supervisor, as mentioned above will oversee and help whenever necessary. The duties of the cabin staff are not interchangeable, meaning one cannot simply switch between serving the Economy class and then the Golden Club class in one particular flight. Therefore, I think it is more precise to calculate the ratio based on the actual number of passengers the cabin staff have to attend, i.e. 1:16 for Golden Club class and 1:43 (128/3) for Economy class.

Even 3 cabin crew will be enough for MAS 734. For flight to PEN from KUL, the crew only need to give out peanuts and OJ/Plain water in EY. So 2 cabin crew in MAS 734 EY section is enough. But of course longer domestic flight such as KUL/BKI is another story.

 

 

so now I think about it there must be 2 FAs in there

There are indeed 2 FAs working in the MAS 734 GCC section. One is leading steward/stewardess.

Edited by Isaac

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Even 3 cabin crew will be enough for MAS 734. For flight to PEN from KUL, the crew only need to give out peanuts and OJ/Plain water in EY. So 2 cabin crew in MAS 734 EY section is enough. But of course longer domestic flight such as KUL/BKI is another story.

You forgot about safety issue. The cabin staff was not there just to hand in peanuts to the passengers. Even for a short flight to Kuantan, as I stressed out in the thread starter, 3 cabin staff in Economy is more likely to handle emergency situation better than 2 cabin staff.

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You forgot about safety issue. The cabin staff was not there just to hand in peanuts to the passengers. Even for a short flight to Kuantan, as I stressed out in the thread starter, 3 cabin staff in Economy is more likely to handle emergency situation better than 2 cabin staff.

But it is not a problem as long as they do not violate the DCA rule. Besides, many western carriers have been doing this for years.

Edited by Isaac

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As for minimum requirement, 4 cabin crew are needed for the B734. The B735 (yes, we used to operate that) had a minimum crew of 3.

 

Carrying 5 crew (or 6, many many years ago) is only for their secondary duty which is passenger service.

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Radzi told me that (he was told that) 4 cabin staff will be carried on non-meal sectors. Meal sectors will maintain 5 cabin staff. So, if it proves to be true, only B734s to BKK, SGN, RGN, BKI, KCH and MYY, which will only have 4 cabin staff.

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Radzi told me that (he was told that) 4 cabin staff will be carried on non-meal sectors. Meal sectors will maintain 5 cabin staff. So, if it proves to be true, only B734s to BKK, SGN, RGN, BKI, KCH and MYY, which will only have 4 cabin staff.

 

Makes sense I suppose - if there's now less service to be provided on the shorter flights then surely they no longer need the extra crew members.

Edited by Keith T

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Radzi told me that (he was told that) 4 cabin staff will be carried on non-meal sectors. Meal sectors will maintain 5 cabin staff. So, if it proves to be true, only B734s to BKK, SGN, RGN, BKI, KCH and MYY, which will only have 4 cabin staff.

 

 

But... They will be no more meal for flight shorter than 4 hours right? How will be things going then?

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