MAS A380 - Fleet to be Retained

[leon t 0]

Tokyo to get A380 in AUG again

 

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/airlineroute/276583/malaysia-airlines-schedules-a380-tokyo-service-in-august-2018/

seems like such short periodof time when they send the A380s to these destinations are more so for likely because the A330s are in for heavy or scheduled maintenance, rather than a real upguage for a sustained period of time. Its all just temporary and as MAB have few A38s sitting on the ground.

[Raj 0]

seems like such short periodof time when they send the A380s to these destinations are more so for likely because the A330s are in for heavy or scheduled maintenance, rather than a real upguage for a sustained period of time. Its all just temporary and as MAB have few A38s sitting on the ground.

Well if you think about it, there will be more A330's by AUG 2018 so it's probably more to do with the loads for that month. In hindsight if they have the loads it's better that the A380 flies rather then being parked on ground. At least they are trying to improvise load and aircraft availability/usage

[S V Choong 4]

So is MH going to retain the A380s!!?? It seems that they keep flipping their decisions....

Edited January 17, 2018 by S V Choong

[leon t 0]

own

 

So is MH going to retain the A380s!!?? It seems that they keep flipping their decisions....

 

MAS/MAB have no choice as they cant sell the 6 frames nor lease it out, and will try to use 2 to 3 frames for Haj under a new company. In the meantime these 6 frames will cost a heavy financial drain and burden as they will not be flying much at all especially after the 1st quarter when the new A350s takes over the London route. The "best" way out is for MAB to start a new chartercompany and hive off these 6 frames to reflect better on its financial results. But in reality MAB or Khanazah will still lose money on these planes.

[flee 5]

The "best" way out is for MAB to start a new chartercompany and hive off these 6 frames to reflect better on its financial results. But in reality MAB or Khanazah will still lose money on these planes.

MAB does not own the aircraft. They are leased from a government SPV (I think it is Terus Pesawat Bhd for some of the aircraft).

 

We don't know if MAB managed to renegotiate the lease - they may even be able to cancel it as they are protected by the MAB Act. Perhaps they should use the "pay per use" model. It may cost more per flight but at least you don't have to pay a fixed amount every month.

[leon t 0]

MAB does not own the aircraft. They are leased from a government SPV (I think it is Terus Pesawat Bhd for some of the aircraft).

 

We don't know if MAB managed to renegotiate the lease - they may even be able to cancel it as they are protected by the MAB Act. Perhaps they should use the "pay per use" model. It may cost more per flight but at least you don't have to pay a fixed amount every month.

Yes the govt have been bailing out MAS since by setting up SPV to then buy over the planes from MAS and then to buy the new planes for MAS and then leased it to MAB. But whatever it is, in reality the govt/MAB will lose money and with these 6 A380s sitting on the tarmac for most of the time soon, it will make it worse and someone will have to pay for the high costs of these frames. In fact, MAB will never make profits even in future if it indeed follow proper accounting and not having the govt to help in by setting up SPV to hide the true costs of airline operations.

[S V Choong 4]

If the A380s were the 747-8i... thing would have been a lot easier. They could convert them into 747-8i BCF/ BDSF and whatever (converted freighters) and sell it to the freight operators or transfer it to MASKargo.

 

Should have ordered the 747-8i instead. **face palm!

[flee 5]

If the A380s were the 747-8i... thing would have been a lot easier. They could convert them into 747-8i BCF/ BDSF and whatever (converted freighters) and sell it to the freight operators or transfer it to MASKargo.

 

Should have ordered the 747-8i instead. **face palm!

I can't remember when the A380 order was placed (maybe around 2003), but at that time it was a "me too" order as SQ were the launch customer. The B747-8I was not even a paper aeroplane then - so there was no question of them ordering that.

 

However, had MH not ordered the A380 and ordered the B747-8I when it was launched, I don't think it will have such a big problem filling their planes. But right now, it does look like a combination of A388 and A359 might just work nicely for MAB's long haul ops.

Edited January 21, 2018 by flee

[jahur 0]

I can't remember when the A380 order was placed (maybe around 2003), but at that time it was a "me too" order as SQ were the launch customer. The B747-8I was not even a paper aeroplane then - so there was no question of them ordering that.

 

However, had MH not ordered the A380 and ordered the B747-8I when it was launched, I don't think it will have such a big problem filling their planes. But right now, it does look like a combination of A388 and A359 might just work nicely for MAB's long haul ops.

Few red flags were already signalling especially with the delays in delivery schedule of the a380. But airbus was willing to compensate them which makes it hard for them to cancel the orders. Think mas would not be in such a deep red situation if they signed up a deal for the B777-300ER but they were more interested in filling up double deckers of 400++ seats and not anticipating the impending gulf carrier invasion and LCC price slashing scheme.

 

Also heard in the past MAS was reluctant to sign any deal with GE so the 777-300er and 747-8i was always not in serious consideration.

Edited January 21, 2018 by jahur

[Rabloo 0]

Few red flags were already signalling especially with the delays in delivery schedule of the a380. But airbus was willing to compensate them which makes it hard for them to cancel the orders. Think mas would not be in such a deep red situation if they signed up a deal for the B777-300ER but they were more interested in filling up double deckers of 400++ seats and not anticipating the impending gulf carrier invasion and LCC price slashing scheme.

 

Also heard in the past MAS was reluctant to sign any deal with GE so the 777-300er and 747-8i was always not in serious consideration.

 

 

Heard an inside story that our then PM was pissed with the US VP at the time, Al Gore, and instructed MAS to buy the A380 rather than buying any big aircraft from Boeing.

[flee 5]

Malaysia Airlines needs to tap pilgrim market 'fast' — CEO

 

See: http://www.theedgemarkets.com/article/malaysia-airlines-needs-tap-pilgrim-market-fast-%E2%80%94-ceo

[Khalil Abd Halim 0]

good to see the A380 has been given another lease of life but quite ironic to see the remark from the CEO referring to other planes in their fleet as "tin can"?

[Mushrif A 3]

good to see the A380 has been given another lease of life but quite ironic to see the remark from the CEO referring to other planes in their fleet as "tin can"?

Im not a lawyer but I cant see where the CEO referred to other aircraft in MHs fleet as tin can.

 

Based on my non-legal, lay-persons mind, the CEO was probably implying that most charters for hajj and umrah are tin cans. And MH can offer a better experience.

[Khalil Abd Halim 0]

Im not a lawyer but I cant see where the CEO referred to other aircraft in MHs fleet as tin can.

 

Based on my non-legal, lay-persons mind, the CEO was probably implying that most charters for hajj and umrah are tin cans. And MH can offer a better experience.

 

how i read it is that he implied other planes than the A380 are tin cans

[Ashley Lee 0]

 

how i read it is that he implied other planes than the A380 are tin cans

I read it as him making a comparison between denser, Haj configurated "tin-cans" i.e. competitors (not necessarily other aircraft type or even a comparison with the remaining MH fleet) with the current, not-as-dense MH A388 configuration.

Edited January 22, 2018 by Ashley Lee

[KK Lee 5]

Mh has been in Hajj and umrah chartered business for many years. For reasons why it didn't become Cash cow, main business or a division/subsidiary.

 

If this business is as profitable as claimed, Saudi extended royal families would have controlled 50% of available slots and seats capacity.

Edited January 22, 2018 by KK Lee

[Khalil Abd Halim 0]

I read it as him making a comparison between denser, Haj configurated "tin-cans" i.e. competitors (not necessarily other aircraft type or even a comparison with the remaining MH fleet) with the current, not-as-dense MH A388 configuration.

nobody cares

[Mushrif A 3]

nobody cares

You may not, but he does. Someone does.

[Newitt 0]

The p1ss-taking needs to stop

[Khalil Abd Halim 0]

The p1ss-taking needs to stop

 

agree!

[Mushrif A 3]

Mh has been in Hajj and umrah chartered business for many years. For reasons why it didn't become Cash cow, main business or a division/subsidiary.

 

If this business is as profitable as claimed, Saudi extended royal families would have controlled 50% of available slots and seats capacity.

Well, apart from Saudia, theres NAS Holdings and Nesma. And if you dig deep enough, you will find royalty already entrenched. During umrah and hajj, you get these folks operating many flights as well.

[Mushrif A 3]

Well, apart from Saudia, theres NAS Holdings and Nesma. And if you dig deep enough, you will find royalty already entrenched. During umrah and hajj, you get these folks operating many flights as well.

And it is these airlines which charter tin-cans to operate such flights for them. So, you could get Lion air 330s, or VIM 772s etc filled to the max

[BC Tam 2]

"Nesma Air, operated by Fly Global" - as plastered on sides of the couple of (I assume) ex-MH 772s lounging about MTB's apron when I dropped by on Sunday morning

Edited January 22, 2018 by BC Tam

[Chris Tan 0]

how i read it is that he implied other planes than the A380 are tin cans

I read it as him making a comparison between denser, Haj configurated "tin-cans" i.e. competitors (not necessarily other aircraft type or even a comparison with the remaining MH fleet) with the current, not-as-dense MH A388 configuration.

nobody cares

 

 

You obviously cared enough to share what you made of the implication.

 

Regardless, I agree with Ashley's assessment that the "tin can" remark probably refers to the cabin configuration, rather than the physical condition of the aircraft..

[flee 5]

"Nesma Air, operated by Fly Global" - as plastered on sides of the couple of (I assume) ex-MH 772s lounging about MTB's apron when I dropped by on Sunday morning

9M-FGA MSN 28530 LN 390, delivered to SQ in 2002.

 

9M-FGB MSN 32318 LN 441, delivered to SQ in 2003.