Rumour: MH to Cut Inflight Meals Beginning 1 October 2007

[Ewan Shamsudin 0]

Thanks Mahmoud, for the info. I noticed that even if you have been a member since June, both your posts are here on this thread so far.

 

A very invaluable piece of (inside) information indeed - in true aviation enthusiast style.

 

This thread is building up in the number of pages very, very quickly!

 

And I'm marking which MH flight NOT to take to/from BKI until 31 December 2007. But then from the list, does it cover all already for the KUL-BKI vv sector?

 

[Rozhan 0]

In my opinion MH will loose a lot of goodwill from customers, especially those who pay their own way. It is difficult to justify paying good money when MH thinks very 'cheaply' of EYCL customers.

[Izanee 0]

i agree with rozhan - i was always impressed with the meals they served on long domestic flights eg. KUL - BKI.

This will only serve to 'cheapen' MH's image. I understand that BA and LH have similar snack boxes but this is the major difference between them and the Asian carriers - inflight services!!

 

I think Peter read was ex-BA. dunno if he's still with MH.

 

paying big bucks for a mat salleh when you have many capable locals such as JJ ong. (sorry - i keep mentioning his name - i'm sure there are many more with years of experience who have been sidelined).

[Alex 0]

OK... Calm down people...

 

Firstly, my experience of travelling with Singapore Airlines, a well renowned 5 star airline most recently from Singapore to Sydney didn't really feel 5 star in terms of food. The midnight flight you get a supper, which either consisted of a hot roll or a cold salad roll and then Breakfast was the warm dish. The way I saw that was Singapore wanting to cut down on costs, so rather than serve 2 hot meals, still serve 2, but one hot and one cold. Heck I could even have a Mars Bar for supper if I wanted to. From Penang to Singapore I only got a hot roll. That's it. They used to serve a hot (somewhat hot) dish but now, a roll. Why? Probably to reduce operating costs but still maintain a 5 star status. Before the hot roll came, IIRC the passengers complained about no hot meals on a 5 star airline like Singapore, hence the reintroduction of a hot meal.

 

MAS are trying to cut down on costs yes. I applaude them for doing that. But I don't think people realise that this is a necessity in order for it to survive well. Qantas only serves a snack box between Sydney and Canberra, heck it serves a snack box between Sydney and Brisbane. But yet they are highly regarded in Australian skies. In order for it to compete with the big boys... It needs to cut on costs. If it meals cutting inflight meals to a snack box then it's still providing you with a meal... But it may not be hot. Does the fact it has to be hot matter?

 

Once MAS figures out the reduction in costs, it can return to quite a nice profitable airline. Until then, I believe MAS are merely catching up with the other players around the region...

 

Alex.

[V Wong 0]

 

Hello, compelled to write my first post here following the confirmation of snack box issue.

 

Last financial quarter, MAS saved RM2million from inflight catering cost cutting. IJ said during the result presentation that "we must be relentless in cost cutting". Staunch MAS supporter that I am, this change will be the last straw that broke the camel's back. I used to feel 'don't know whether to cry or laugh' (to borrow from Chrisrad) when I receive a snack box during KLM or Lufthansa flight.

 

 

[KK Lee 5]

MH is really going downhill - rather than up its game and increase services to get more paying pax - they have downsized in terms of staff, aircraft, assets, inflight services in order to save a few bucks. while that may be the case during Mr. Jala's tenure - I think this profit they are making will not last long as its just a temporary fix to the problem. selling six jumbos will give you lots of money for sure. getting rid of many routes which they didn't even give a chance to work is another. Manchester has a HUGE catchment area - at least 1 million in greater MAN and 1.2 million in Leeds/Bradford, 1 million in East Yorkshire. Also the Northwest and Northeast england!!!! HUGE. Emirates can make it with multiple flights to London, birmingham, manchester, glasgow AND EVEN newcastle. come on Idris. get your act together. THEY CAN'T EVEN MAKE LONDON WORK! THEIR VERY OWN FLAGSHIP ROUTE - MH 001 for god's sake. All other airlines are struggling to get more services to LHR. We have been gifted 100 000 pax/year from BA - still MH is struggling with their cheap shitty plastic trays. The meal service has definitely gone downhill over the last few years - i used to be extremely proud of MH's meals as compared to BA, SQ, QF, and EK during my trips to and fro UK the past ten years. I was shocked with the cheap trays and the lack of tasty deserts on the flights I took in June. THAT is LONG HAUL. Imagine snack boxes for regional routes. Forget 5 star with LCC cost. that is the most irritating statement ever made. That made me go off Idris Jala. Look at SIA's inflight services. Look at their plans for the A380. in fact - look at their CURRENT 77W services!!!! my god. we can either up our game or start comparing our services to GARUDA, PHillipine airlines (which is buying more 773s) and Biman bangladesh. (no offence to fans of those airlines but you have to agree their services are s#1t).JJ Ong - who managed to turn around MASKargo is also gone now. Since he has gone - they have less aircraft and they have cut back on lots of freighter routes - for e.g. Manchester, Basle, Milan Malpensa. Dubai is getting cut off as well. How are they going to increase freight through KUL - we have been stuck at 650 - 670 000 tonnes/annum. singapore is handling 1.9 million tonnes now. if they can't make dubai (another freighter hub) work - how will they make Tashkent work????so they sacrifice the connections from major African/middle eastern and European markets for a few goats and chickens from Baku, Dushanbe or Bishkek???what the hell are they thinking??? I have been following malaysia's aviation scene for many many years now - just when i think it will get better- somed10t shows up with ludicrous ideas. just my tuppence worth...

I have always learnt that cutting back is not the best way to get out of crisis. And making a product cheaper, and more uninteresting, neither. You have to generate something unique, then you have an argument against your comeptitor.I don't understand why MH is doing that bad.... probably they should do more marketing activities in foreign countrys, so they generate more inbound pax. MAS is still (was?) an insider tip for travelling to asia... No adverts, no big representation here in austria, even when they operated to vienna.So where should the pax come from?And remember, by cutting routes you tendentially make the airline more unattractive, because a network depends on it's routes.For me it's sad to see MH going downhill. As i said in early posts, MH was a lifeline for me, and I really enjoyed being guest onboard, and I also have a certain personal relationship to MH; but if i compare service between my first flight on MH in 1992 and 2002, it wennt down a lot. And when I compare 2002 to 2007, its almost a disaster. 2007 - not even printed manue cards in Golden Club Class.... even Biman Bangladesh has those...The catering on EWR - ARN is just a joke (in Golden Club Class)....I don't understand why they always start cutting corners on F&B Service - this is the least significant part of cost in an airline ticket, and when prices increase for F&B, I guess no customer would complain to pay $5 more for a ticket, but keep the quality.Management overhead and administrative chaos - these two things are the money eaters. But of course, a manager would never dream of cutting costs in his fields. Because even if he fails and he ruins the airline to death, he will surely receive a good bonus and gratification.

 

I concurred with you both.

Guess those IJ worshipper is about time to realise he is a man after all, he will run out of tricks pretty soon.

 

Qantas only serves a snack box between Sydney and Canberra, heck it serves a snack box between Sydney and Brisbane.

 

I was served a hot meal on QF between SYD and MEL last year.

 

 

Edited September 24, 2007 by KK Lee

[Keith T 2]

Firstly, my experience of travelling with Singapore Airlines, a well renowned 5 star airline most recently from Singapore to Sydney didn't really feel 5 star in terms of food. The midnight flight you get a supper, which either consisted of a hot roll or a cold salad roll and then Breakfast was the warm dish. The way I saw that was Singapore wanting to cut down on costs, so rather than serve 2 hot meals, still serve 2, but one hot and one cold. Heck I could even have a Mars Bar for supper if I wanted to. From Penang to Singapore I only got a hot roll. That's it. They used to serve a hot (somewhat hot) dish but now, a roll. Why? Probably to reduce operating costs but still maintain a 5 star status. Before the hot roll came, IIRC the passengers complained about no hot meals on a 5 star airline like Singapore, hence the reintroduction of a hot meal.

 

That's been the way SIA has operated for years, post-SARS. If you'd been on the 8pm departure to SYD it'd have been a hot dinner, then cold continental breakfast. And the 9am departure would've seen you eating the same cold continental brekkies, and a hot lunch. The continental breakfast has not changed as far as I remember.

 

People would also be interested in learning that the same cost cuts are happening over at SQ, "Achieving More With Less" is the mantra. I can't release too many details but I've seen the current management turned down several pax-friendly initiatives at the new T3 that really shows the changed culture of SQ - from being an innovative leader to one focussed on penny pinching. And don't even get me started on the PPS Club and the state of the lounges in SIN.... Takes a lot for me to switch FFP/airline allegiance and that's what I've done earlier this year which says a lot about the 'new' SQ.

 

But I don't think people realise that this is a necessity in order for it to survive well. Qantas only serves a snack box between Sydney and Canberra, heck it serves a snack box between Sydney and Brisbane. But yet they are highly regarded in Australian skies.

 

Not true - Qantas serves meals on Cityflyer services, ie flights that run between the capital cities. However these meals are served during 'designated meal times', at other times you receive some sort of snack.

 

Breakfast - Bacon and egg muffin, juice, muesli, fruit

Lunch - Panini (usually beef, but I got a turkey and cranberry sauce one for MELSYD last week)

Dinner - Pasta

 

Alcohol is also free on weekdays after 4pm on Cityflyer flights.

 

Meals are also served on longer non-Cityflyer services, like SYD-CNS, MEL-CNS, SYD-DRW etc.

 

Then again is it really that important to draw these comparisons. Why should it make things seem better at one airline, just because another airline might do things worse? IMO the thinking should not be something defeatist like "it could've been worse", it should be "this is not as good as I know it can be." If I get a crap meal on my MELSYD flight, I'd complain - I wouldn't be thinking "oh i should be grateful I even get a meal because pax in the US don't get anything." For a company can only improve with pax feedback - so make some noise, or vote with your wallet.

Edited September 24, 2007 by Keith T

[Mohd Azizul Ramli 2]

Agreed. I understand the sentiment most of the forumers here towards MH. It reminds me of how 'patriotic but unresourceful' I was during the first few months I joined Airliners.Net more than a year ago, where issues pertaining MH were being discussed in 'global' level. MH is espected to fully turned arround by 1 January 2008, so it is just matter of time when this confirmed snack box issue will be reviewed again. I am sure once MH got its act together (financially), the hot meals for the effected routes can be reintroduced.

 

As Alex and V Wong mentioned, SQ had undergone the same phase too (cut full meals - introduced snacks - reintroduced full meals). Earlier posts in this thread mentioned about LH's snackbox, if it really true, then LH must have been improving their inflight meals too because when I flew them on 4 segments back in March 2004 (LHR-HAM-FRA-HAM-LHR, LHR-HAM-LHR were international routes, 464 miles each way), I was only given a cup of juice and a bun, which was handed out together with a napkin.

Edited September 24, 2007 by Mohd Azizul Ramli

[Alex 0]

That's been the way SIA has operated for years, post-SARS. If you'd been on the 8pm departure to SYD it'd have been a hot dinner, then cold continental breakfast. And the 9am departure would've seen you eating the same cold continental brekkies, and a hot lunch. The continental breakfast has not changed as far as I remember.

 

Not true - Qantas serves meals on Cityflyer services, ie flights that run between the capital cities. However these meals are served during 'designated meal times', at other times you receive some sort of snack.

 

Breakfast - Bacon and egg muffin, juice, muesli, fruit

Lunch - Panini (usually beef, but I got a turkey and cranberry sauce one for MELSYD last week)

Dinner - Pasta

 

Alcohol is also free on weekdays after 4pm on Cityflyer flights.

 

Meals are also served on longer non-Cityflyer services, like SYD-CNS, MEL-CNS, SYD-DRW etc.

 

Point 1: On the early morning Sydney - Singapore flight you get two hot meals. One is a breakfast and one is a lunch style thing. On SQ232 which I took most recently, you get two meals. One lunch and one tea meal... Both hot, but I got stuck with western meals both times. I know that with SQ221 you get at least one very nice and one nice meal whereas with SQ231 you get average to really crap meals. Yes, cost savings are probably the reason behind it.

 

Point 2: I never said Qantas doesn't serve meals on its services. I said they serve cold servings more than ever with drinks etc... on its services to keep costs low. The lunch you mentionted is actually a cold meal, hence saves money. I do agree that with dinners they serve nicer meals. Bacon and Egg Muffin is quite similar to what SQ serve on their continental breakfast style. Sydney - Darwin is nearly 3.5 - 4 hours, as is Sydney / Melbourne - Cairns and even the Perth services from Sydney / Melbourne and on those services, full meals etc... are served. But you can see Qantas does use meals and gives cold sandwiches etc... saving them a lot of money in the long run.

 

Sentiment is high on change from MAS I can read... But the airline industry these days is all about trying to cut down dramatically on costs yet at the same time provide the high service and product it's renowned for. Malaysia Airlines are just trying to catch up and keep up.

 

Alex.

[Keith T 2]

Point 1: On the early morning Sydney - Singapore flight you get two hot meals. One is a breakfast and one is a lunch style thing. On SQ232 which I took most recently, you get two meals. One lunch and one tea meal... Both hot, but I got stuck with western meals both times. I know that with SQ221 you get at least one very nice and one nice meal whereas with SQ231 you get average to really crap meals. Yes, cost savings are probably the reason behind it.

 

Point 2: I never said Qantas doesn't serve meals on its services. I said they serve cold servings more than ever with drinks etc... on its services to keep costs low. The lunch you mentionted is actually a cold meal, hence saves money. I do agree that with dinners they serve nicer meals. Bacon and Egg Muffin is quite similar to what SQ serve on their continental breakfast style. Sydney - Darwin is nearly 3.5 - 4 hours, as is Sydney / Melbourne - Cairns and even the Perth services from Sydney / Melbourne and on those services, full meals etc... are served. But you can see Qantas does use meals and gives cold sandwiches etc... saving them a lot of money in the long run.

 

Sentiment is high on change from MAS I can read... But the airline industry these days is all about trying to cut down dramatically on costs yet at the same time provide the high service and product it's renowned for. Malaysia Airlines are just trying to catch up and keep up.

 

Alex.

 

- Unfortunately I've never travelled SYDSIN, only SINSYD, meals of which I've described. But some of the meals on MELSIN would mirror SYDSIN or other ex-east coast flights, and to describe it as 'two meals' is a bit misleading for the sub-7/8 hour flights - one is a full tray meal, the other is a refreshment (or the 'tea meal' as you described). I'd also consider the continental breakfast a refreshment. MELSIN is a bit different because we do not have curfews at MEL and so we have a midnight departure:

SQ218 (0050 dep) - refreshment, and hot breakfast prior to landing

SQ238/228 (1010 or 1110 dep, and 1530 or 1700 dep respectively, depending on season) - lunch/dinner, pre-landing refreshment (usually a very nice chicken and mushroom/leek pie which I always have, or rice/noodles of some sort - oh and a tim tam! )

SIN-MEL is as I described in my previous post for SIN-SYD.

 

I'm glad though that they see fit to serve 2 hot meals on the early morning SYDSIN.

 

- On point 2, that is not what you claimed earlier. You implied only a snack box is served on SYD-CBR and SYD-BNE, both of which are Cityflyer services. This is incorrect when meals are served on these services during designated meal times as I've pointed out. Perhaps you meant on some of those services, as you alluded to in 'point 2.'

 

- SQ doesn't serve bacon and egg muffin for their continental breakfast or the breakfast would hardly be considered continental. The bacon and egg muffin is like the Bacon & Egg McMuffin you can buy at McDonald's and is a hot food item.

 

QF's bacon and egg muffin (sorry not a good pic, but it's amongst that foil wrap)on a typical Cityflyer breakfast departure (i've had the same thing MEL-SYD, MEL-CBR - routes I frequent, with minor variations in type of muesli and type of fruit):

 

SQ's continental breakfast:

Edited September 24, 2007 by Keith T

[KK Lee 5]

 

We all agreed MH need to cut cost to be profitable.

 

The question is, where is MH is heading to and is the management doing the right thing?

 

Why is the management keep comparing MH with carriers with inferior and poorer service. Are they MH peers?

 

If this trend continues, won’t be surprise, MH will one day retrofit 10 and 9 abreast to its 772 and A333 fleet.

 

 

 

[Walter Sim 1]

MH used to serve the REFRESHMENTS in KUL-MEL with desert last time. Theres Juice+Roll/Sandwich+anzac biscuit(EX MEL)+tea other stuff.

 

As i can see from chrisrads pic indeed it has been degraded. Just the roll/sandwich. It can pass off as a mid movie snack anyways........

[T Azahan 1]

MH can kiss its 5 star rating good bye!!!

 

i think its purely stupid to come up with that meal box. crap!! cost is higher in europe and usa thus justifies meal box or pretzels.

we are a 5 star asian airline. our trademark is hospitality. MH shouldnt forget its strengths. but MH always forgets about lots of things!! :angry: :angry: <_ src="%7B___base_url___%7D/uploads/emoticons/default_mad.gif" alt=":angry:">

 

i fly ak laaa then and get stella to serve me nasi lemak. better!!!!

[Isaac 0]

If this trend continues, won’t be surprise, MH will one day retrofit 10 and 9 abreast to its 772 and A333 fleet.

I'll be very happy as long as MAS don't announce they are squeezing more EY seats into their 333, 744 & 772

[Keith T 2]

- On point 2, that is not what you claimed earlier. You implied only a snack box is served on SYD-CBR and SYD-BNE, both of which are Cityflyer services. This is incorrect when meals are served on these services during designated meal times as I've pointed out. Perhaps you meant on some of those services, as you alluded to in 'point 2.'

 

Apologies for my error there. Forgot that SYDCBR is a little bit shorter than MELCBR and only offers 'refreshments' despite being a Cityflyer service. Wonder what's with the difference - I get hot meals on MELCBR (good in the morning so I don't have to stop somewhere for breakfast before work) even though the advertised flight duration is only 10 minutes longer than SYDCBR.

Edited September 24, 2007 by Keith T

[Izanee 0]

saving 2 million ringgit a quarter (or 8 million a year) on catering is nothing compared to the wages they pay their senior managers (see previous articles on this forum) and the money they lose by allowing senior people and politicians to fly FREE OF CHARGE in their first class. that's why there's no money made on first and GCC. its not because they can't fill seats - its because they CAN'T FILL SEATS WITH PAYING PAX.

 

get rid of some of the baggage at the top - they don't need to be there. tell them to get a real job.

Edited September 24, 2007 by Izanee

[KK Lee 5]

Breakfast

 

A Sandwiches 3 slices (3 types of different filling per

passenger) in transparent box with sticker

 

 

Brunch/Lunch/Light

 

A. Sandwiches 3 slices (3 types of different

filling per passenger) in transparent box with

sticker

 

If creativity at MH is any gauge, the sandwiches is likely to be ‘egg mayo’, ‘tuna mayo’ and ‘chicken ham/meat loaf’, and they will be using trans fat margarine on the bread rather than proper butter.

 

 

[Victor A. 2]

OK... Calm down people...

 

Firstly, my experience of travelling with Singapore Airlines, a well renowned 5 star airline most recently from Singapore to Sydney didn't really feel 5 star in terms of food. The midnight flight you get a supper, which either consisted of a hot roll or a cold salad roll and then Breakfast was the warm dish. The way I saw that was Singapore wanting to cut down on costs, so rather than serve 2 hot meals, still serve 2, but one hot and one cold. Heck I could even have a Mars Bar for supper if I wanted to. From Penang to Singapore I only got a hot roll. That's it. They used to serve a hot (somewhat hot) dish but now, a roll. Why? Probably to reduce operating costs but still maintain a 5 star status. Before the hot roll came, IIRC the passengers complained about no hot meals on a 5 star airline like Singapore, hence the reintroduction of a hot meal.

 

MAS are trying to cut down on costs yes. I applaude them for doing that. But I don't think people realise that this is a necessity in order for it to survive well. Qantas only serves a snack box between Sydney and Canberra, heck it serves a snack box between Sydney and Brisbane. But yet they are highly regarded in Australian skies. In order for it to compete with the big boys... It needs to cut on costs. If it meals cutting inflight meals to a snack box then it's still providing you with a meal... But it may not be hot. Does the fact it has to be hot matter?

 

Once MAS figures out the reduction in costs, it can return to quite a nice profitable airline. Until then, I believe MAS are merely catching up with the other players around the region...

 

Alex.

 

 

i agree with you Alex. before we all condemn MAS to the pit of the earth, lets look at what others (airlines) have to offer first. once we have experience what others have offered, then only we can say things towards MAS.

[Rozhan 0]

MAS is slated to trumpet 'Malaysian Hospitality' or 'MH' in its next round of promotional exercise and brand building. Wonder what kind of hospitality it intends to potray when they are dishing out mediocre snack boxes like as if paying customers are visiting Hari Raya openhouse hoping for free food! When customers pay a premium, they expect tangible and superior products as opposed to Low fares minus frills.

Edited September 24, 2007 by Rozhan

[Alex 0]

Apologies for my error there. Forgot that SYDCBR is a little bit shorter than MELCBR and only offers 'refreshments' despite being a Cityflyer service. Wonder what's with the difference - I get hot meals on MELCBR (good in the morning so I don't have to stop somewhere for breakfast before work) even though the advertised flight duration is only 10 minutes longer than SYDCBR.

 

I haven't done a QF CBR - MEL in years... So I don't know what they offer. I do agree that at the right time, QF offers a decent hot meal in the flight. Definitely only a refreshment for Sydney to Canberra though.

 

Keith am just trying (and not succeeding too well) to show that MAS aren't removing meals all together, merely they are 'downsizing' to try and save money. Apologies if any misinterpretations happened. I do know though that a cold meal 'snack box' style (Panini was served in a snack box) was given to me during Lunch on QF19 so it's really Breakfast and Dinner where Qantas offer hot meals. Maybe MAS are heading towards that direction.

 

Like said, I do believe MAS are catching up wih other airlines in the region.

 

Alex.

[Keith T 2]

I haven't done a QF CBR - MEL in years... So I don't know what they offer. I do agree that at the right time, QF offers a decent hot meal in the flight. Definitely only a refreshment for Sydney to Canberra though.

 

Keith am just trying (and not succeeding too well) to show that MAS aren't removing meals all together, merely they are 'downsizing' to try and save money. Apologies if any misinterpretations happened. I do know though that a cold meal 'snack box' style (Panini was served in a snack box) was given to me during Lunch on QF19 so it's really Breakfast and Dinner where Qantas offer hot meals. Maybe MAS are heading towards that direction.

 

Like said, I do believe MAS are catching up wih other airlines in the region.

 

Alex.

 

Point well taken.

I was merely trying to clear up some facts. Sorry for being overly argumentative if that's what it came across as.

 

About downsizing - I suppose someone has to start. That's what airlines did in response to the competition from LCCs in the US and Europe. And LCCs are a fairly new phenomenon in Asia. I've always found it amazing and am very thankful that I get full hot meals on even short segments like HKG-BKK or SIN-BKK.

 

So on a bigger picture - is MH's move the beginning of the end for full meal services on short regional Asian hops?

That is, if other carriers decide to try to cut costs and follow MH's lead. I mean - that's unfortunately one of the side effects of competition - a dive towards the lowest common denominator.

Edited September 24, 2007 by Keith T

[Seth K 3]

saving 2 million ringgit a quarter (or 8 million a year) on catering is nothing compared to the wages they pay their senior managers (see previous articles on this forum) and the money they lose by allowing senior people and politicians to fly FREE OF CHARGE in their first class. that's why there's no money made on first and GCC. its not because they can't fill seats - its because they CAN'T FILL SEATS WITH PAYING PAX.

Haha, isn't MH is Malaysian government company thou? Yeah 8 million is nth compare to the price of a plane either

[Alex 0]

No probs Keith.

 

Alex.

[Izanee 0]

SIA is a government company - i don't see their politicians flying free!

lee kuan yew did very well to stamp out corruption within his government.

 

its about time we did something too.

[Keith T 2]

SIA is a government company - i don't see their politicians flying free!

 

It is also a public listed company. The government owns 54.8% through their holding company Temasek. So it still has other shareholders it is accountable to.

 

What's the ownership structure of MH?

Edited September 24, 2007 by Keith T