MAS likely to cancel A380 orders

[Pieter C. 5]

TG was able to negotiate 'extra' A330's by retaining the 380's; why is MH not putting pressure on Airbus by having a tenfold 'free' A320's to modernize their regional fleet ???

[Seth K 3]

TG was able to negotiate 'extra' A330's by retaining the 380's; why is MH not putting pressure on Airbus by having a tenfold 'free' A320's to modernize their regional fleet ???

Pieter, I love if MH follow TG with the bargaining system, but I doubt MH wants A320. Who knows, if and only if MH differ their order to 77W/787, Boeing might give lots of 737's at heavy discount From TG case, see how desperate Airbus has to sacrifice to maintain the A380 image, hard to say about A380 market, but I predict they won't reach break even(who gonna order, BA, SAA, CX, US, JL, GF, more from VS/SQ/QF?) ............plus all the cost they have to put up with, I bet the BE is higher now Well, it's also too late to cancel the programme, I say just carry on Now I also start to doubt 748pax but not F, still too early to predict everything, but just my 2 cents...

Edited March 20, 2007 by Seth K

[Seth K 3]

MAS should cancel and buy a new narrow-body fleet which is it's bread and butter!! Also, the airline should really go one way - 777 or A330. Lower them operating costs! The decision is nowadays more like 777 vs 787 vs A350 vs A330. I say go for the 787s now and order some 748s!

Can't agree no more there!!! Go for one manufacturer, if Airbus, then all the way Airbus vv. Ordering new planes definitely should be the hot topic. I'm sure lots of ppl like to grab those flying A330's, *cough Tony* cough

[Sandeep G 1]

TG was able to negotiate 'extra' A330's by retaining the 380's; why is MH not putting pressure on Airbus by having a tenfold 'free' A320's to modernize their regional fleet ???

 

We took that deal.. it's just that the tenfold 'free' A320s turned out to be the same cost to Airbus as one A319CJ and well, in complete commercial and operational sense, our boys opted for the latter.

 

[Pieter C. 5]

We took that deal.. it's just that the tenfold 'free' A320s turned out to be the same cost to Airbus as one A319CJ and well, in complete commercial and operational sense, our boys opted for the latter.

 

 

Very smart to take delivery of the 319 first and than cancel the 380 order

 

[BC Tam 2]

Come on lah guys, our own Minister of Transport (no less !) has assured everyone Malaysia will not cancel the 380 order - as reported here

Oh hold on a bit, he said won't cancel "due to delivery delays" There must be 1,000+1 other reasons, why worry !

[Chan CS 0]

Hope this is not too late, from TheEdge

 

7 Apr 2008: Corporate: MAS likely to get US$40m in damages from Airbus

By Doreen Leong

Email us your feedback at fd@bizedge.com

 

 

Malaysian Airline System Bhd (MAS) is likely to receive some US$40 million (about RM132 million) in damages from aircraft manufacturer Airbus SAS for the delays in the delivery of A380s, based on similar compensation obtained by its peers.

"MAS will probably get the same quantum of compensation payment as Singapore Airlines and Qantas Airways," says a source. This should provide some relief for losses totalling RM58.4 million that MAS incurred due to the delays in the delivery of A380s in FY2007 ended Dec 31.

Last Monday, MAS went ahead with the purchase of six A380s, to be delivered in 2011, after concluding talks with Airbus. The national carrier said that after extensive discussions with Airbus and its parent company, Penerbangan Malaysia Bhd, they have agreed on the terms for the delayed delivery of the planes.

"The terms include an agreement on the amount of compensation for the delay," said MAS. The national carrier also announced the purchase of up to 55 B737-800 aircraft.

However, industry observers say that while the compensation from Airbus should not differ much from its other customers, terms or discounts given to each may vary.

"While MAS has opted for Boeing's 737-800 planes, favourable terms provided by Airbus under the negotiations could win Airbus MAS' widebody plane orders," notes one industry observer.

Australia's Qantas Airways is booking in "recognition of A$104.4 million of liquidated damages from Airbus" that will be paid over time until the final delivery of the Rolls-Royce Trent 900-powered aircraft.

Initially, Qantas ordered 12 A380s planes, which means an average of US$6.4 million in compensation per plane for a two-year delay. The carrier, which has another 10 options on the A380s, was originally due to have taken delivery of its aircrafts in 2006.

That was later pushed back to the 1H2007 and again pushed back to late 2007, as a result of production delays that have forced Airbus to delay nearly all early A380 deliveries by around six to seven months. As at end February this year, Airbus has 190 orders for its A380s.

To date, Qantas ordered 20 A380 aircraft with options for four more, with the first aircraft being delivered in 2008.

Meanwhile, Singapore Airlines (SIA) has recognised liquidated damages amounting to a total of S$41.4 million in its FY2007 ended Dec 31.

According to reports, it is believed that SIA negotiated a very favourable discount from Airbus in return for not cancelling its orders for nine of the much-delayed aircraft. Not only did the airline confirm the purchase of nine additional A380s, it had also agreed to buy 20 A320 narrow-body planes.

SIA was to have been the grand launch customer in 2006, but this plan was shelved when Airbus announced a two-year delay in A380 deliveries due to wiring problems.

Currently, SIA has three A380 superjumbos, which were introduced last October. The carrier has also placed orders for another 16, with an option to buy six more.

However, SIA's A380 flights have been plagued with problems since it launched its maiden flight to Sydney. Last month, the airline's A380 were grounded for the third time in less than two months. Glitches ranged from faulty fuel pump to auxiliary brake problems.

However, SIA said the double-decker Airbus has a generally excellent record and its entry-into-service record has been substantially better than any other new aircraft type that it has received.

Dubai-based Emirates is now by far the biggest single A380 operator with 58 new aircraft due to enter service. The airline said a compensation deal has been concluded last year.

 

The most interesting part is that SQ ordered 20 A320, is that for silk air?

 

[Ryan Soh 3]

Hmm... 20 A320s? That's news to me too! It could be an order to replace the present MI's fleet presently as by the time these new birds are ready for delivery, it would be time to gradually phase out the older batch of baby-buses. MI currently operates a fleet of 11 Airbuses so this order isn't too far fetched.

[Nick C 0]

Hope this is not too late, from TheEdge

 

The most interesting part is that SQ ordered 20 A320, is that for silk air?

 

Wonder why they only bring this up in the article now. It's pretty old news considering that the order was inked end of 2006. 11 firm orders + 9 options.

 

http://www.silkair.com/mbe/en_UK/content/c...01_20122006.jsp

[Chan CS 0]

Wonder why they only bring this up in the article now. It's pretty old news considering that the order was inked end of 2006. 11 firm orders + 9 options.

 

http://www.silkair.com/mbe/en_UK/content/c...01_20122006.jsp

 

The main subject of the article is that MAS likely to gets compensation from Airbus. And that the 20 A320 is just a side note, there is also many other side notes relating to A380.

[James Gota 0]

mas should preasure Airbus to give free spares for the A380 with 2 spare engines and free crew training or change to all Boeing get the 787-8/9, 777-200LR so it could go to new places, 737-700ER/800 and 900ER so it could go to Cairns and Darwin and 747-8 so it can replace its 747-400's

 

 

 

2 wrong's don't make a (W)right but 2 (W)right's make an airplane

 

Planes flown on Boeing 747-400 777-200 -200ER on Malaysian Airbus A319 A320-200 and Boeing 767-300ER on Royal Brunei

[KC Sim 2]

I was at the media event where SIA increased its order for A380 by nine airframes and SilkAir signed a deal for 20 A320s. The journalist was clearly not paying attention to the proceedings when she reported that SIA placed the order for A320s.

 

The signing ceremony between SIA and Airbus took place ahead of another signing ceremony between SilkAir and Airbus. Unless one had one drink too many, one could not possibly have mistaken Mike Barclay (then SilkAir's CEO and now with IATA in Singapore) as SIA's CEO.

 

A case of shoddy journalism.

 

KC Sim

[Kenneth T 0]

The A380s is a ugly planes....just cant wait to see MH cancel it. I personally think B787 and B748 will suits MH route better.

[jani 0]

No one is ordering the 747-8I's for a reason.

 

I just hope they take the easiest and simplest option by ordering the 777-300ER.

[Sandeep G 1]

No one is ordering the 747-8I's for a reason.

 

I just hope they take the easiest and simplest option by ordering the 777-300ER.

 

well, with the problems with the GE-90-115B, and alot of speculation regarding ETOPs certification for the 77W due to a large number of ISFD associated with the engine, the 748I perhaps may appear more attractive to prospective airlines.

 

Perhaps MAS may even place an order for the type who knows!

[Kenneth T 0]

Perhaps MH can be one of the launch customer for B748.

[TW Teo 0]

Cancel the A380 and order the B747-8i just because the A380 is ugly in your eyes? Don't be ridiculous. Why would MAS want to do that and lose their delay compensations? And to order a plane such as the B747-8i which no airline wants is even more laughable. I'm not surprised if the B747-8i program is cancelled altogether.

 

I see MAS's widebody fleet will swing towards Airbus with or without the A380. If there's a huge huge discount, why not? Planes are there to make money, not to look pretty.

Edited May 1, 2008 by TW Teo

[Sandeep G 1]

Cancel the A380 and order the B747-8i just because the A380 is ugly in your eyes? Don't be ridiculous. Why would MAS want to do that and lose their delay compensations? And to order a plane such as the B747-8i which no airline wants is even more laughable. I'm not surprised if the B747-8i program is cancelled altogether.

 

I see MAS's widebody fleet will swing towards Airbus with or without the A380. If there's a huge huge discount, why not? Planes are there to make money, not to look pretty.

 

I never said cancel the A380 - Merely that the 748-I may perhaps be a welcome alternative for MH to consider.

 

Furthermore, you're right, Planes ARE there to make money and not to look pretty - but no-one knows how the 748-I compares economically with the A380, but I wouldn't discount Boeing on providing an exemplerary aircraft suited to the needs of airlines such as MAS.

[TW Teo 0]

Sorry Sandeep, I was replying to Kenneth T's statement:

 

The A380s is a ugly planes....just cant wait to see MH cancel it. I personally think B787 and B748 will suits MH route better.

 

I should have quoted it earlier, but you're right, whichever manufacturer who can provide the better deal should get it. It's just at the moment, it is in favour of Airbus it seems.

[LeeCH 0]

The only reason, and based on fact, is that the B748 is not winning orders at all is because the seat cost per mile/km is substantially higher than the A380. At today's current oil price and the B748 having a lower payload, it is hard for airlines to justify book orders for B748. Trust the bean counters of SQ to get this calculation right. It is not just the novelty of operating the world's first double decker jetplane.

[Pieter C. 5]

Airbus Talks On Site Sales May End, A380 Delays

 

May 4, 2008

Airbus may run into problems selling some of its factory sites, and could be forced to further delay some deliveries on its A380 superjumbo, according to German media reports.

 

The divestment of French plants in Meaulte and St Nazaire Ville to aerospace firm Latecoere may be terminated as financing the deal could be difficult in current market conditions, German daily Die Welt reported on Saturday, quoting Airbus Chief Operating Officer Fabrice Bregier.

 

"The economic environment combined with tension in the financial markets and the alarming decline of the dollar compared to the euro exist for Latecoere too," it quoted Bregier as saying.

 

A decision will be taken in May, Bregier added.

 

A spokeswoman at Airbus declined to comment.

 

Latecoere is in exclusive negotiations to buy control of two Airbus factories at Meaulte in northern France and and Saint-Nazaire in western France.

 

The divestment process is a key plank of Airbus's "Power 8" restructuring plan aimed at cutting costs in the wake of damaging delays to its aircraft production timetable, and in the face of a strong euro.

 

But the plans are opposed by unions and caused political fireworks in France and Germany last year, while the relentless rise of the euro against the dollar has led Latecoere, which makes doors for Airbus and Boeing, to move its own production out of the euro zone.

 

Die Welt and German business magazine WirtschaftsWoche also said Airbus may have to further delay deliveries of its A380 superjumbo, the world's largest airliner.

 

WirtschaftsWoche said, citing an insider, Airbus would not be able to meet its target of delivering 25 planes in 2009 due to mounting production problems, and that the company had already informed customers of the delay in a letter.

 

Asked for a reaction, the spokeswoman at Airbus cited comments Chief Executive Tom Enders made on Tuesday in the United Arab Emirates on the A380 superjumbo's delivery targets.

 

"Tom Enders has asked for a complete review of the A380 program, knowing he's always said it would be an enormous challenge to manage the (production) ramp-up... This review is not over so I cannot comment on these figures," she said.

 

On Tuesday, Enders said he remained confident of meeting delivery targets -- for 13 double-decker passenger planes in 2008 and 25 in 2009 -- but called this a "difficult subject."

 

Airbus has not ruled out fine-tuning the A380 delivery timetable, which has already slipped three times.

 

Deliveries of the A380 have fallen almost two years behind schedule after a series of industrial problems since 2005.

 

The A380 went into service last year with Singapore Airlines but is heavily bankrolled by Dubai-based airline Emirates, which ordered 58 of the USD$300 million planes in a historic civil aviation order worth over USD$17 billion.

 

(Reuters)

 

[Hardeep P. 0]

Think MH will definately follow TG with both 747-8I and A380.

Any more ASIAN airliners thinking of ordering the 747-8I? Probably CX, JL, CI?

What happened to EK's plan for 747-8Is?

[Simon 3]

According to the news today, there will be further delay of the delivery of 25 A380 in 2009.