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S V Choong

About Subang in her heyday

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1. The Saudi 747 case - is it possible for a ground engineer to taxi the plane???

 

If the Engineer is certified to do that... why not.. wink.gif

 

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Oh because in Malay language "t" is pronounced like "d"...

Hah, remember Bahasa Baku that was introduced throughout Malaysia (in govt dept; newsreaders; secondary schools) in late 80s/90s? Could it be the root to SV's theory?

 

Those of us in govt' SM schools have to un-learn our un-bahasa baku BM pronounciation, to prepare esp. for Ujian Lisan SPM.

 

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Azmal,

 

The Boeing 707 rego N705PA originally belongs to Pan American Airways. Then somewhere along the line it was transferred to PIA and then to Royal Fiji..... I found the history of this aircraft.... HERE

 

Just do a search on N705PA, after the page is shown, there is a link down the bottom which says "profile and history of B707...msn...", click on it and check mate......

 

It was scrapped at "Scrapped Kelaua Jaya Park,Subang,Kuala Lumpur (restaurant)" I suppose they mean Kelana Jaya which is nearby Subang Airport. But no date was given.

 

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Hah, remember Bahasa Baku that was introduced throughout Malaysia (in govt dept; newsreaders; secondary schools) in late 80s/90s?

 

Denny, I guess you noticed too huh? "t" sounds like "d"? It looks to me the actual variation in pronouncing is not much of difference, for example, "tua" and "dua", "teman" and "degan". It sounds very similar when pronounced in Bahasa Baku. Hence I think it actually have an impact on Malaysian style English, although I have never spoken much of English when I was in Malaysia, but I have a workmate in NZ to testify this...... He could not pronounce words with "th", hence he will pronounce it as "dausen" (thousand)". "dink" (think), "drow" (throw) and etc.

 

Actual English pronouncation of "t" and "d" words are quite different and it is very appearant. Hence, decend down to two four zero zero, when spoken in Malaysian or Singaporean style English can be "disen down do doo for ziro ziro" can be very hard for foreigners to make out!

 

I was told that I am a great Bahasa Baku speaker when I was in KL...... laugh.gif At least it had an impact upon somebody like me despite it was a not-so-successful movement smile.gif

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Azmal,

 

The Boeing 707 rego N705PA originally belongs to Pan American Airways.  Then somewhere along the line it was transferred to PIA and then to Royal Fiji.....  I found the history of this aircraft.... HERE

 

It was scrapped at "Scrapped Kelaua Jaya Park,Subang,Kuala Lumpur (restaurant)"  I suppose they mean Kelana Jaya which is nearby Subang Airport.  But no date was given.

4119[/snapback]

 

SO it was last with Royal Fiji when it was decided to have the airplane as a 'monument'.

 

Good work!

 

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I have sent a private message to the photograph's owner, Mr. Stefan Martin, lets hope he knows the story about this a/c. The last owner of the 707 seems to be AeroAmerica.... very odd

 

By the way Azmal, I think the 707 was intended to be a restaurant as highlighted above.

 

Thank you for the 707 movie, how and where did you download it? Seems very strange.... like from some age old Malay movies on RTM TV2 smile.gif

 

Finally, the link should be http://www.aerotransport.org

Just do a search on N705PA, after the page is shown, there is a link down the bottom which says "profile and history of B707...msn...", click on it and check mate......

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Thank you for the 707 movie, how and where did you download it?  Seems very strange....  like from some age old Malay movies on RTM TV2 smile.gif

 

 

 

Oh, I captured it while it was on air late 2003 - I used to have a TV TUner Card - it's one of those "Esok" series of movies starring Jins Shamsuddin... smile.gif Sorry for the poor quality tho - reception not good where I was.

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Doubt it.  That was many centuries ago.  It would have a great impact if and only if the Portuguese did conduct something like forcing the Malays to abandon their language and everyone learnt Portuguese.  More over, the Portuguese who stationed in Melaka did not leave in Malaysia that much of an impact compared to the English.  The English was the last colonialist.  It is more like how "t" is actually pronounced in the Malay language, which sounded like a "d".

 

9M-MKB was scrapped after the PEK-KUL flight.  It was believed that the cargo it held was some lethal chemical to aluminium alloy which leaked during flight and hence weakened the structure of the a/c.  A/C was written off and scrapped.  It was parked outside the MAS maintenance area at KLIA for a while.

 

Azmal, that looks like the 707 which was stranded at SZB.  I shall conduct more research into it.

4109[/snapback]

 

Or I shall say most languages don't pronounce the way "t" is pronounced in English... Whether the "t" is in front of a word or the word ends with "t," Malaysians pronounce differently from native English speakers... That's what I notice... cool.gif

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Maybe it's a bit off-topic to talk about this here, but since someone mentioned it, what was the final fate of HZ-AIO? Was it scrapped in KUL or sent back using ship?

 

RE: MAS 707 video

 

So that meant MAS used to fly to Kuwait? blink.gif When they discontinued it?

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Or I shall say most languages don't pronounce the way "t" is pronounced in English... Whether the "t" is in front of a word or the word ends with "t," Malaysians pronounce differently from native English speakers... That's what I notice... 

 

Negative Teoh, in Japanese "t" is almost pronounced the same way as English, for example "Tokyo" and also in most Chinese dialects and standard Chinese (Mandarin). For example, the "T" as in "Tu zhi" (rabbit)... smile.gif

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Negative Teoh, in Japanese "t" is almost pronounced the same way as English, for example "Tokyo" and also in most Chinese dialects and standard Chinese (Mandarin).  For example, the "T" as in "Tu zhi" (rabbit)... smile.gif

4150[/snapback]

 

My mistake... I meant to say languages with a, b, c, d, and the like...

Yeah... I am aware that Japanese pronounce "t" that way... The rabbit in Chinese "Pin Yin" is indeed "tu zhi" with respective accents, but "pin yin" itself was invented based on the English phonetics; me best surmise... Wrong?

 

Could be a coincidence Malay "t" is pronounced the Portugese way and not due to Port. influence... I don't know...

 

How about the Arabs? Do they pronounce like English or Portugese?

 

Oh btw, any of you know why Malay language writing was changed from Arabic (Jawi) to ABC...XYZ, at least on the large scale?

 

An interesting linguistic discussion... rolleyes.gif Off topic, though... My apology...

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Oh btw, any of you know why Malay language writing was changed from Arabic (Jawi) to ABC...XYZ, at least on the large scale?

 

 

 

 

That's the handiwork of Tan Sri Khir Johari while he was Minister of Education in 1963. He downright abolished the Jawi from schools altogether.

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Yeah... I am aware that Japanese pronounce "t" that way... The rabbit in Chinese "Pin Yin" is indeed "tu zhi" with respective accents, but "pin yin" itself was invented based on the English phonetics; me best surmise... Wrong?

 

I know that a lot of Chinese Malaysian mispronounced "t" sound in Chinese as "d", there are many out there who would say "du zhi" rather than "tu zhi". No, the Chinese do not invent their phonetics based on the English language. Given the political climate at the time when China invented the Hanyu Pinyin system, the US and the West were pretty much their enemy during the Cold War. What makes you think that the Chinese invented their phonetics based on English? Just because the Chinese romanised their writing? There are many pronounciation in the pin yin itself does not corrrespond to the English language. For example, the Z, Q, X sounds. Do you know the pin yin system well? Despite the romanisation effort of Chinese, it cannot be written entirely in roman alphabets nor do I see the need to do so.

 

Could be a coincidence Malay "t" is pronounced the Portugese way and not due to Port. influence... I don't know...

 

This wouldn't give you any credit, it was a long time ago and as I said the influence was restricted to Melaka, a tiny colonial outpost back then.

 

How about the Arabs? Do they pronounce like English or Portugese?

 

I don't think every language is influence by the English or other European languages. Why are you so obsessed in this? In many parts of the world, English and other European languages is not spoken or understood. For example in China and Japan, people do not give a damn about English or European languages as much as we do in Malaysia. So it really helps if you know how to speak Mandarin or other Chinese and Japanese to get around China, Taiwan and Japan.

 

Oh btw, any of you know why Malay language writing was changed from Arabic (Jawi) to ABC...XYZ, at least on the large scale?

 

Malay is suppose to be a proto-language which means it doesn't have a fixed writing form. In the past Malay has been writing with Indian writing (Hindi or Sanskrit) scripts, the Arab influence came in later with Islam. After the colonial periods especially after the British, it is written in Roman alphabets. Although the Malay language has many loan words (especially from English nowdays) and the actual pronounciation or the grammar remains typically Malay. Don't forget that Malay also have loan words from Chinese and Indian which came in much earlier than English. But this is normal to any languages in any parts of the world. Don't forget, the Chinese and Indian languages also have considerable influences in the Malay language, given the close proximity of us living under the same roof.

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I know that a lot of Chinese Malaysian mispronounced "t" sound in Chinese as "d", there are many out there who would say "du zhi" rather than "tu zhi".  No, the Chinese do not invent their phonetics based on the English language.  Given the political climate at the time when China invented the Hanyu Pinyin system, the US and the West were pretty much their enemy during the Cold War.  What makes you think that the Chinese invented their phonetics based on English?  Just because the Chinese romanised their writing?  There are many pronounciation in the pin yin itself does not corrrespond to the English language.  For example, the Z, Q, X sounds.  Do you know the pin yin system well?  Despite the romanisation effort of Chinese, it cannot be written entirely in roman alphabets nor do I see the need to do so.

This wouldn't give you any credit, it was a long time ago and as I said the influence was restricted to Melaka, a tiny colonial outpost back then.

I don't think every language is influence by the English or other European languages.  Why are you so obsessed in this?  In many parts of the world, English and other European languages is not spoken or understood.  For example in China and Japan, people do not give a damn about English or European languages as much as we do in Malaysia.  So it really helps if you know how to speak Mandarin or other Chinese and Japanese to get around China, Taiwan and Japan.

Malay is suppose to be a proto-language which means it doesn't have a fixed writing form.  In the past Malay has been writing with Indian writing (Hindi or Sanskrit) scripts, the Arab influence came in later with Islam.  After the colonial periods especially after the British, it is written in Roman alphabets.  Although the Malay language has many loan words (especially from English nowdays) and the actual pronounciation or the grammar remains typically Malay.  Don't forget that Malay also have loan words from Chinese and Indian which came in much earlier than English.  But this is normal to any languages in any parts of the world.  Don't forget, the Chinese and Indian languages also have considerable influences in the Malay language, given the close proximity of us living under the same roof.

4212[/snapback]

 

Oh, Choong, why speak as if I have offended you a lot...?? unsure.gif

 

I am not obsessed at "West influence East" but any attempt to label your native sounds using the Roman alphabets is a testimony to certain extent of Western inlfuence... Wrong?? Even the Japanese single out this form of labeling known as "Romanji," i.e. "Roman". Wrong? blink.gif

 

I just wanted to know if there are sounds similar with "t" and "d" in the Arabs and how they are pronounced...

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Err, this discussion has certainly gone off the rails. Let's stick back to the original topic shall we?

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I am not obsessed at "West influence East" but any attempt to label your native sounds using the Roman alphabets is a testimony to certain extent of Western inlfuence... Wrong?? Even the Japanese single out this form of labeling known as "Romanji," i.e. "Roman". Wrong? 

 

First of all, the Japanese don't call it "Romanji", it should be "Romaji". "Roma" refers to Rome and "ji" refers to writing. Romanisation of a language means an attempt to write a language in the roman alphabets. It is done for some practical purposes, especially for foreigners when they come to learn a language afresh. By romanisation means the attempt to match the correct pronunciation of a language as close as they can. It wouldn't alter that particular language because not many people who speak that language as a first language would not be interest in the romanisation of their language. Japanese for example, not particular interested in their romanisation of their language when they have to write in Japanese. Neither do the Chinese, Korean and the Arabs. Romaji is nothing more than a tool and a medium, which only serves as a secondary aid.

 

When I was learning Japanese, I started off with Romaji. When I remember all the Japanese kana (writings) I have not used Romaji ever since and nowdays I only write Japanese in kana and kanji (chinese characters).

 

I guess I was annoyed because I didn't think you could use some logic. Sorry about that.

 

I just wanted to know if there are sounds similar with "t" and "d" in the Arabs and how they are pronounced...

 

May be it is pronounced as TMD laugh.gif

 

Yes, Azmal we shouldn't be talking about this..... Completely off topic.......

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Azmal, here are some oldies at SZB

 

MAS Airbus A300 B4-203, rego 9M-MHC, 1982

http://www.airliners.net/open.file/657831/L/

 

SIA Boeing 737-112, rego 9V-BBE at Subang. Former MSA equipment

http://www.airliners.net/open.file/300613/L/

 

Last Day of Subang.....

http://www.airliners.net/open.file/251071/L/

 

Air Ceylon DeHavilland Comet 4 (may be at Simpang/Sugai Besi), 1963,

 

Note the Qantas Land Rover.... Subang only begin to exist from 30 August 1965

 

http://www.airliners.net/open.file/332049/L/

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I'm ahead of you, Choong! laugh.gif Found them before by inputting '9M', 'Malaysian',''Malaysia' and 'MH' and selecting 'Any field' in the search box at A.net. I also browsed through piccies captured at SZB ( I like the old airport like 1000x times better than KLIA). Thanks anyway. wink.gif BTW, it's depressing isn't it people from other countries seem to have more pics of our aviation scene, e.g. piccies of MH B707, all were shot outside the country by tourists. blink.gif huh.gif

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Some more pics I found:-

http://www.airliners.net/open.file/767715/L/ (MAS B742, 9V-SQO)

 

Some of the pics not found under Airline Search for 'Malaysia Airlines':

 

http://www.airliners.net/open.file/182414/L/ (MAS DC103, 9M-MAS)

http://www.airliners.net/open.file/411179/L/ (BOAC B707, G-ASZF, with MAS titles)

http://www.airliners.net/open.file/346754/L/ (MAS B732, 9M-AQL [9M-MBA], Heathrow)

http://www.airliners.net/open.file/107267/L/ (MAS DC103 in Tokyo)

 

(there is at least another one of a MAS B707 in Tokyo that I recall seeing but cannot relocate. Will edit this once I come across it again)

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BTW, it's depressing isn't it people from other countries seem to have more pics of our aviation scene, e.g. piccies of MH B707, all were shot outside the country by tourists.  blink.gif  huh.gif

4396[/snapback]

 

We're working hard to correct that inbalance smile.gif smile.gif smile.gif

 

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(there is at least another one of a MAS B707 in Tokyo that I recall seeing but cannot relocate. Will edit this once I come across it again)

 

Apparently I have a similar photo. I remember seeing the MSA 707 with Japan Airlines' Convair CV-880 at HKG Kai Tak taken during the 1970s. So that will give you two clues for the search smile.gif Not sure about the MAS B707....

 

Good Luck Azmal

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More:-

 

http://www.airliners.net/open.file/828952/L/ [DC-10-30 9M-MAS at Long Beach, CA, US during final assembly before delivery]

 

http://www.airliners.net/open.file/583819/L/ [b707-320 9M-ATR/MCR at Glasgow, Scotland, UK. What was it doing there?!]

 

http://www.airliners.net/open.file/066440/L/ [DC-10-30 9M-MAT landing at YSSY]

 

http://www.airliners.net/open.file/603195/L/ [A300 OY-KAA in full MAS livery at ESSA 14 mths before it crashed short of the runway at SZB]

 

http://www.jetphotos.net/viewphoto.php?id=235814 [9M-MHJ at YMML]

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Apparently I have a similar photo. I remember seeing the MSA 707 with Japan Airlines' Convair CV-880 at HKG Kai Tak taken during the 1970s.  So that will give you two clues for the search smile.gif  Not sure about the MAS B707....

 

Good Luck Azmal

4432[/snapback]

 

FOund it!

 

http://www.airliners.net/open.file/532905/L/

 

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Found more info of N705PA Boeing 707 courtesy of Stefan Martin, photographer of photo number 662963of Airliners.net

 

Stefan has given me a word file which contains history of the aircraft as outlined below, I have included the later part of the aircraft life only.

 

N705PA 17686/124

 

Royal Fiji Military Forces (Sub L)3.8.1979

To fly Fijian pease keeping forces to the Middle East. Arrived at Nadi and parked. CFW III titles removed at Nadi 30.8.79. Arr. KL 3.10.79 with engine trouble en route Nadi/Fiji-Beirut on an EO charter. Aeroamerica’s operating cert. revoked by FAA 15.11.79. At KL 8.1.80 in ex PIA c/s.

 

Malaysian Civil Aviation 23.8.1980

Impounded by Malaysian Civil Aviation Department, 23.8.80 due to unpaid fees. TT47734. A/c was being used to fly Fijian troops to Beirut for UN peace keeping duties.

 

Malaysian Civil Aviation, 1980

Reg. canx., 5.81 last owners L&S. Abandoned at KL. Seen 1982 with Royal Fiji Military Forces titles by forward pax door. Moved to Kelaua Jaya Park for display late 1984. TT47734.

 

 

I wonder if anyone has seen this craft at Kelaua Jaya Park (Kelana Jaya Park?). Does anyone have more info? Azmal? Is it still there? Or has it gone to the scrap metal place? Thanks for the photos Azmal, by the way!

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Pleasure's all mine, Choong! smile.gif A fan of the old MAS livery I am! smile.gif

 

I haven't been to PJ/KJ in like almost 10 years now (even though I live in KL!), so cannot tell if the bird is still there. Maybe our other members who live nearer might know?

 

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