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Yang Zulhilmi

Condor in KUL

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Trade between Germany and Malaysia is smaller than neighbouring countries. Without daily flight, business traveller would choose to use me3, BKK and sin.

 

Im not sure that is right. The figures I read online are that total trade between Malaysia and Germany are around EUR14 billion similar to EUR14 billion for Singapore.

 

https://www.destatis.de/EN/Themes/Economy/Foreign-Trade/Tables/order-rank-germany-trading-partners.html?__blob=publicationFile

Echoing Izanee's comments:

 

Top 5 export markets from DE to ASEAN (in billions):

1) Singapore - €7.97

2) Malaysia - €5.18

3) Thailand - €5.07

4) Vietnam - €4.11

5) Indonesia - €2.86

 

Top 5 import markets from ASEAN to DE (in billions):

1) Vietnam - €9.77

2) Malaysia - €8.95

3) Singapore - €6.58

4) Thailand - €6.13

5) Indonesia €3.80

 

Top 5 trade (imports and exports), German ranking in parenthesis:

1) Singapore - €14.56 (32)

2) Malaysia - €14.13 (33)

3) Vietnam - €13.88 (34)

4) Thailand - €11.20 (37)

5) Indonesia - €6.66 (44)

 

Just like I know Malaysia. We are neither the top/best nor the bottom/worst but we are always in a happy medium :)

 

But odd that TH which has less trade than MY with DE in almost all aspects but managed to attract LHG's airlines: LX, LH (from FRA with 380 and MUC with 350 nonetheless), and OS to BKK, don't you think, Mr. Lee :)

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Echoing Izanee's comments:

 

Top 5 export markets from DE to ASEAN (in billions):

1) Singapore - €7.97

2) Malaysia - €5.18

3) Thailand - €5.07

4) Vietnam - €4.11

5) Indonesia - €2.86

 

Top 5 import markets from ASEAN to DE (in billions):

1) Vietnam - €9.77

2) Malaysia - €8.95

3) Singapore - €6.58

4) Thailand - €6.13

5) Indonesia €3.80

 

Top 5 trade (imports and exports), German ranking in parenthesis:

1) Singapore - €14.56 (32)

2) Malaysia - €14.13 (33)

3) Vietnam - €13.88 (34)

4) Thailand - €11.20 (37)

5) Indonesia - €6.66 (44)

 

Just like I know Malaysia. We are neither the top/best nor the bottom/worst but we are always in a happy medium :)

 

But odd that TH which has less trade than MY with DE in almost all aspects but managed to attract LHG's airlines: LX, LH (from FRA with 380 and MUC with 350 nonetheless), and OS to BKK, don't you think, Mr. Lee :)

 

 

Than why KUL couldn't sustain a non-stop daily flight to DE?

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Than why KUL couldn't sustain a non-stop daily flight to DE?

You tell us. You are the one going around telling people there is a direct correlation between trade and demand for air travel.

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Kuala Lumpur is 5th most visited city in the world after Bangkok, Paris, London and Singapore. Market is there but need proper strategy

Where do the visitors come from? That kind of data is more useful for airlines, not just the absolute numbers of people.

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Where do the visitors come from? That kind of data is more useful for airlines, not just the absolute numbers of people.

STB has a pretty useful statistics spreadsheet (of course they do) on how visitors get to SG.

 

Singapore Jan-Jul 2019 Visitor Arrivals

 

Malaysia has a nice page for visitor arrivals too but has way too many parameters for their interactive charts to be useful. However, they provide a nice summary for the top 45 visitor arrivals.

 

Malaysia Jan-Jun 2019 Visitor Arrivals

 

MY and SG counts their visitor arrivals differently. SG doesn't count Malaysians who visited SG by land. MY only counts them as a visitor if they spend at least one night in Malaysia (IIRC).

 

Since we are discussing about DE-SG/MY, here are the arrivals from DE to MY/SG for Jan-Jun period:

MY: 69,092

SG: 203,016

 

Why do you say Condor is stopping flights to KUL?

Because they have removed their flights from GDS.

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Coming from a friend working at LH Office in KL, the load was just not there all year round to sustain KUL-FRA when LH used to fly into KUL. Premium demand was not there, leisure demand was neither too good nor too bad. They tried to make it work with CGK tag on but they found out later it was an expensive operation with two different sets of crew stationed overseas. They found out they could deploy their aircraft much more profitably elsewhere in their system. After LH stopped KUL, LH Group planned to use Eurowings Long Haul to operate FRA-KUL, but it was shoved into back-burner as they tried to stabilise their Europe operation. Glad that they did not proceed with the plan judging from the chaos within EW since its inception.

Edited by JuliusWong

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You tell us. You are the one going around telling people there is a direct correlation between trade and demand for air travel.

 

Yes, business travellers are very important to airlines.

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Our Nic tried out DE for his trip home last year

Described it as an AK experience on long haul flight

If based on cost vs product consideration alone, doubt if he will opt for a repeat somehow

Certainly put me off sufficiently to have even considered that option for us earlier this year

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Our Nic tried out DE for his trip home last year

Described it as an AK experience on long haul flight

If based on cost vs product consideration alone, doubt if he will opt for a repeat somehow

Certainly put me off sufficiently to have even considered that option for us earlier this year

I survived a D7 A343 return flight to ORY but I managed to grab their launch fare. The product was the same as what we get on their Asian routes but the flight was twice as long. If I had to pay their normal fares, I doubt that I will be keen since the ME3 fares are only about 20% more. And sometimes, we even get fares that are very close to what D7 is charging.

 

There is a reason why they are not able to sustain their ORY and LGW services...

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I survived a D7 A343 return flight to ORY but I managed to grab their launch fare. The product was the same as what we get on their Asian routes but the flight was twice as long. If I had to pay their normal fares, I doubt that I will be keen since the ME3 fares are only about 20% more. And sometimes, we even get fares that are very close to what D7 is charging.

 

There is a reason why they are not able to sustain their ORY and LGW services...

 

20% more? you sure? QR offering to MUC from KUL at RM 2k return.

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Been on Condor 757-300 flights when Easyjet purchased Air Berlin's domestic route. Flew the Berlin Tegel airport to Munich route!

 

It's quite a good airline, seats are a bit LCC like though But I was more into the 757-300 than anything else!

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20% more? you sure? QR offering to MUC from KUL at RM 2k return.

That was a long time ago.

 

Yes, these days, KUL-ZRH return can be going for around RM 2K too...

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Ive flown thomas cook A330-200 from MAN to MCO... flew premium economy one way and economy the other. The recline was not great but it wasnt as bad as I thought it would be! The crew were great and the food was alright.

It was cheaper than VS and BA

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not quite, I just booked one.

What I meant was D7's days of flying to Europe was a long time ago. These days, the competitive situation is even greater. That is why they keep hesitating about returning to Europe - they may never be able to do so without losing money! Condor might also be feeling this lack of yields. Edited by flee

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What I meant was D7's days of flying to Europe was a long time ago. These days, the competitive situation is even greater. That is why they keep hesitating about returning to Europe - they may never be able to do so without losing money! Condor might also be feeling this lack of yields.

 

Condor is a hybrid, they are not like D7 that provides totally no frills services.

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Isn't KUL always supposed to be seasonal for Condor?

 

The Winter 19/20 season ends in March.

DE started Winter 2018. Was supposed to be seasonal but extended beyond April (Easter school holidays) to year-round service but reduced frequency. DE flights end January 2020 (iso March/April 2020) so I guess they won't be returning to Malaysia W20/21. Can't imagine the crew cost for a 2-3 weekly long-haul flight tho.

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Is Condor saying goodbye on 26 March 2020?

 

The state Thomas Cook is in nowadays, the goodbye may not last till 26 Mar 2020 - maybe next week even ? :unsure:

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