Cathay Pacific Quits Kuala Lumpur; Cathay Dragon (Dragonair) to Take Over from March 2017

[Kenneth Chong WT 0]

But you get better catering tho. You'll get "refreshments" now!

As opposed to "meal"?

 

Was on KA 425 HKG to KUL...the tray was missing Bread Roll and Butter and Fruits...Instead we were give a yummy packet of Coffee Butter Biscuits and Häagen Das ice cream...I had the fish...kinda bland...hope to get better meal on the flight back.

[Jeremiah Wong 0]

Poor KUL. And MAHB still boasts about how well they're doing or have achieved. Ya, they managed to get Himalayan United Bangladesh Uzbekistan and other third world countries carrier.

[Muhammad Firdaus 0]

Poor KUL. And MAHB still boasts about how well they're doing or have achieved. Ya, they managed to get Himalayan United Bangladesh Uzbekistan and other third world countries carrier.

 

It's not that they dumped KUL altogether. By replacing the route with KA equipment (which is 100% owned by Cathay Pacific) they are actually doing smart cost management which in turn will give cost effective operation. KUL in a way does not loose anything as they are still collecting charges from them unless they reduce the number of flights, and airport charges on airlines are not based on the country's status.

[Jeremiah Wong 0]

It's not that they dumped KUL altogether. By replacing the route with KA equipment (which is 100% owned by Cathay Pacific) they are actually doing smart cost management which in turn will give cost effective operation. KUL in a way does not loose anything as they are still collecting charges from them unless they reduce the number of flights, and airport charges on airlines are not based on the country's status.

I think it's more than just that. It means we are not quite there yet in comparison to BKK and SIN. The airport may be profitable but not our economy. If our currency will be more stable CX won't stop flying to KUL. FYI, KA serves secondary cities and that shows how unimportant KUL is to CX. U may argue KA is CX vv but truth is we're secondary.

[geoff.leo 0]

In terms of capacity and connectivity, it doesn't make a difference to KLIA.

 

But it does KLIA no good with regards to it's profile.

 

We clearly have a problem with attracting full-service carriers, even the big ones from within our region.

 

And for those big full-service carriers that do fly here, their footprint in Malaysia is miniscule compared to SIN and BKK. In many cases, KLIA is also behind CGK, MNL and even both Vietnamese hubs in attracting the big boys.

 

Cathay's introduction of Dragon into KLIA will not help reverse that situation. It's not a good thing.

[leon t 0]

MAHB will never be able to catch up to either SIN or BKK.

[Mohd Suhaimi Fariz 2]

MAHB will never be able to catch up to either SIN or BKK.

 

Given the amount of Negative Nancies this country have I'm not surprised.

 

Much ado about nothing honestly. It's not like CX is leaving for good. They have an desire to expand but for the onerous contract they have with their staff, they needed to circumvent that - and circumvent they did by transferring flights to KA. It's as simple as that.

 

Malaysians needs to stop with their hangups over status to be honest.

[Jeremiah Wong 0]

Given the amount of Negative Nancies this country have I'm not surprised.

 

Much ado about nothing honestly. It's not like CX is leaving for good. They have an desire to expand but for the onerous contract they have with their staff, they needed to circumvent that - and circumvent they did by transferring flights to KA. It's as simple as that.

 

Malaysians needs to stop with their hangups over status to be honest.

I would say we should progress and take on both SIN and BKK.

[Izanee 0]

Negative Nancies LOL!!

 

KUL is not doing too bad considering all the negativity out there. We have breached >50 million pax per year mark so we are slowly getting there. Whether or not we will overtake SIN or BKK I don't know but we are certainly not doing too badly.

[flee 5]

Malaysians needs to stop with their hangups over status to be honest.

Yes, and we should run businesses in a commercial and professional way. If you do things for the wrong reasons (e.g. status), that is when market forces will punish you.

[jani 0]

I guess airports like AMS, LAX etc are also doing badly because they can't retain MH service?

 

Wait, or is it because MH is not doing well, hence pulled out?

 

Wait again, is CX doing well? Hm....

 

KUL has breached 50 mppa even with a downsizing home carrier, which is important to the growth of any airport.

 

It's kinda crazy that in a thread about CX suddenly the one being blamed is MAHB.. haha

[Craig 0]

 

Much ado about nothing honestly. It's not like CX is leaving for good. They have an desire to expand but for the onerous contract they have with their staff, they needed to circumvent that - and circumvent they did by transferring flights to KA. It's as simple as that.

That is true - CX wants to hand over more regional flights to KA due to cost structure (and IIRC, pilot shortages as well). But the thing is, out of all the Asian ports, KUL was the first to go, not even DPS/SUB etc.

 

 

It's not that they dumped KUL altogether. By replacing the route with KA equipment (which is 100% owned by Cathay Pacific) they are actually doing smart cost management which in turn will give cost effective operation. KUL in a way does not loose anything as they are still collecting charges from them unless they reduce the number of flights, and airport charges on airlines are not based on the country's status.

MAHB doesn't lose anything. Only premium passengers lose in this case (and to a certain extent, Y pax catering). KA is still much better than MI in this aspect - lounge access to OWE/OWS, ability to accrue and redeem miles on KA flights, etc.

 

I guess airports like AMS, LAX etc are also doing badly because they can't retain MH service?

 

Wait, or is it because MH is not doing well, hence pulled out?

 

Wait again, is CX doing well? Hm....

It's both. MH and the Malaysian economy weren't robust these past few years.

[Mohd Azizul Ramli 2]

Who is Nancy?

[CX B. 0]

I guess airports like AMS, LAX etc are also doing badly because they can't retain MH service?

 

Wait, or is it because MH is not doing well, hence pulled out?

 

Wait again, is CX doing well? Hm....

 

CX is not doing well but you don't see them pulling out of SIN, BKK or even a holiday destination like DPS (as Craig says, and where both KA and CX are serving concurrently). It makes people wonder why a capital city like KL and its main airport can't keep a major carrier in the APAC region like CX, or say Qantas or Asiana. Why are we not attractive enough is a question we much deal with if we want to see KUL bloom. MAHB financially sustainable or not is one thing, but the missed opportunity to attract major carriers (which translates to more foreign businesses and investments) is another thing.

[KK Lee 5]

Beside o&g industry, there aren't many business in the country are world class player and GDP is not growing like Burma or Vietnam. Hence, fewer business Traveller visit KUL.

 

Beside LCC traffic, KUL could only play second fiddle to BKK and sin.

Edited April 29, 2017 by KK Lee

[Alif A. F. 0]

 

CX is not doing well but you don't see them pulling out of SIN, BKK or even a holiday destination like DPS (as Craig says, and where both KA and CX are serving concurrently). It makes people wonder why a capital city like KL and its main airport can't keep a major carrier in the APAC region like CX, or say Qantas or Asiana. Why are we not attractive enough is a question we much deal with if we want to see KUL bloom. MAHB financially sustainable or not is one thing, but the missed opportunity to attract major carriers (which translates to more foreign businesses and investments) is another thing.

Because Malaysia (west Malaysia and KUL in particular) is too close to SIN and Changi already establishes itself as unofficial aviation hub for west Malaysia. Thailand and in particular BKK is considered a hub for Indo-China or mainland southeast asia... Thailand is as everyone knows massively popular leisure destination in itself and fits the imagination of general western tourists as representing the whole of South East Asia and a good starting point for tourists wishing to tour the region.

[Chris Tan 0]

 

Much ado about nothing honestly. It's not like CX is leaving for good. They have an desire to expand but for the onerous contract they have with their staff, they needed to circumvent that - and circumvent they did by transferring flights to KA. It's as simple as that.

 

Malaysians needs to stop with their hangups over status to be honest.

Image aside, there's a legitimate reason some people are angry over the CX withdrawal.

 

As pointed out earlier in the thread, KA is nothing short of a downgrade from CX. With the latter there's a decent chance of getting the long-haul J product with pleasant Malaysian FAs who know their regular passengers very well. You get none of that on KA with their robotic, overworked FAs who are already complaining about working the KUL turnarounds.

[Craig 0]

Image aside, there's a legitimate reason some people are angry over the CX withdrawal.

 

As pointed out earlier in the thread, KA is nothing short of a downgrade from CX. With the latter there's a decent chance of getting the long-haul J product with pleasant Malaysian FAs who know their regular passengers very well. You get none of that on KA with their robotic, overworked FAs who are already complaining about working the KUL turnarounds.

You just reminded me about the service aspect of it too. And also the loss of PEY service to KUL.

[CX B. 0]

You get none of that on KA with their robotic, overworked FAs who are already complaining about working the KUL turnarounds.

 

Not complaining about KA's inflight service, but it is true that KA crews (and even CX's) are actively avoiding KUL flights by giving it away whenever possible. At least that's what I heard from people working in CX/KA.

 

Because Malaysia (west Malaysia and KUL in particular) is too close to SIN and Changi already establishes itself as unofficial aviation hub for west Malaysia. Thailand and in particular BKK is considered a hub for Indo-China or mainland southeast asia... Thailand is as everyone knows massively popular leisure destination in itself and fits the imagination of general western tourists as representing the whole of South East Asia and a good starting point for tourists wishing to tour the region.

 

Totally right! SIN is already an established hub and BKK is a strong market. Which is a sad case for us. But KUL's master plan suggests that it envisions itself as a major hub too, and things don't seem to develop in this direction - firstly with AF and LH pulling out, and now CX. When the big players are abandoning you, it is hardly convincing to portray the image necessary for attracting other major airlines and opening new routes.

[Mohd Suhaimi Fariz 2]

When the big players are abandoning you, it is hardly convincing to portray the image necessary for attracting other major airlines and opening new routes.

Airline decision making are based on hard data, not emotion. They don't choose to fly to a place just because that airport has the "right" airline - they choose to fly to a place because there's traffic & they are able to leverage that to make money.

 

Besides, as Jani rightly pointed out, just because an airline pulls out of the market doesn't mean there's anything inherently wrong with the market. It could be an issue with the airline itself. You can't really say that AF, LH & CX are doing very well at the moment of withdrawal now do they? Contrast that with KL (especially in comparison with its sister company AF).

Edited April 29, 2017 by Mohd Suhaimi Fariz

[KK Lee 5]

Airline decision making are based on hard data, not emotion. They don't choose to fly to a place just because that airport has the "right" airline - they choose to fly to a place because there's traffic & they are able to leverage that to make money.

 

Besides, as Jani rightly pointed out, just because an airline pulls out of the market doesn't mean there's anything inherently wrong with the market. It could be an issue with the airline itself. You can't really say that AF, LH & CX are doing very well at the moment of withdrawal now do they? Contrast that with KL (especially in comparison with its sister company AF).

For AF, LH and CX to withdraw from KUL mean yield, profitability and forecasted traffic is below threshold.

 

KL could survive because of code share with MH to Australia.

[CX B. 0]

Airline decision making are based on hard data, not emotion.

Yes exactly. Which is what I have been trying to say in my previous post - that these airlines pulling out of KUL but not other regional hubs like SIN and BKK, and even leisure destinations like DPS, actually says a lot about KUL's attractiveness - and that is something we (or rather MAHB) have to address.

[S V Choong 4]

Yes exactly. Which is what I have been trying to say in my previous post - that these airlines pulling out of KUL but not other regional hubs like SIN and BKK, and even leisure destinations like DPS, actually says a lot about KUL's attractiveness - and that is something we (or rather MAHB) have to address.

Again that sorta proved my points from many years ago. KUL has less to offer compared to Bangkok and Singapore.

[flee 5]

Yes exactly. Which is what I have been trying to say in my previous post - that these airlines pulling out of KUL but not other regional hubs like SIN and BKK, and even leisure destinations like DPS, actually says a lot about KUL's attractiveness - and that is something we (or rather MAHB) have to address.

I think KUL should not kid itself that it is a world class destination. If we remove the traffic from the Airasia Group airlines, it will be a rather second rate 30m p.a. pax airport.

 

CX and other FSCs have ample numbers to prove that KUL attracts mostly low yield pax and are therefore adjusting their presence to compete in that category. There is nothing wrong with that - you can't beat the market after all.

[Mr.Bandit 0]

So the last flight for CX will departs tomorrow?