T Azahan 1 Report post Posted March 8, 2006 and 320 is a must buy to compete with AK. love those aircraft. simple.... a. pay rm300 for return trip to PEN on mh seven three four; or b. pay rm200 for similar trip on AK's three twenty.... no brainer to choose better deal...... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
H Azmal 0 Report post Posted March 8, 2006 (edited) We need to get out of the pride of having "the biggest airline of SEA", "The National(-istic?) Carrier" with "the most modern fleet in the world" kind of emotion if MAS is to pull out of the red. It is after all, a business, and I see no point in having all these -est things if the carrier keeps on making losses. It's not good for me to get a Rolls Royce if my house is about to be repossesed. It's only logical that I sell my Proton to keep the more important thing, the house. I may also draw a parallel here to having the tallest building in the world but of what use is it if it's more than half empty? MAS started out in 1972 realistically - we did not rush in getting 747s - we acquired 2nd hand 707s. Sometimes humbling situations like that will force the best out of us, as it has proven. When MAS is back up flying high in the sky again, it can get those A380s - for now it has to concentrate on preventing itself from collapsing. Think of Sabena and Swissair. And oh, how come MAS having all A320s will cause it to be seen as a no-frills carrier but AirAsia with the same type of aircraft is somehow elevated to national carrier status? :?: Edited March 8, 2006 by H Azmal Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bing Chu 0 Report post Posted March 8, 2006 ..... and I see no point in having all these -est things if the carrier keeps on making losses..... Your down to earth view of things is a very refreshing indeed after the 'Malaysia Boleh' banter of the last decade or so !! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
S V Choong 4 Report post Posted March 8, 2006 (edited) Imagine MAS as a rich guy with a family, at first driving a BMW or other Euro cars, with a big house and pedigree dogs. After the Asian Economic Crisis of the late 90s hit, MAS lost all the Euro cars, pedigree dogs and end up selling the big house for a small one. End up leasing Proton, Japanese and Korean cars for daily use. Today, MAS is lost the small house, his wife and family has left him and is now selling up all assets to take public transport to work. Literally, MAS is now having only his underpants to gamble with....... I reckon this is the last gamble....if the battle is lost....... it will be a total lost. Edited March 8, 2006 by S V Choong Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Khushwant 0 Report post Posted March 8, 2006 waht a bloody stupid move MAS....keep those 747-400...ur making a silly move by selling it. sell the 330's. i personally think , the A380 is a waste of time. Like ppl will say, too big for the dustbin. Get the 787 instead. PLEASE , PLEASE think Mr.Idris....i wouldnt wana be flying to sydney all the time in a smaller plane. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Leo 0 Report post Posted March 8, 2006 In this case if MH lost it only hope of success, will Air Asia become the national carrier? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Milla 0 Report post Posted March 8, 2006 Another big LOL for MAS, ditch those airbus orderla. Also ditch A330 family type and abuse 744 and T7 on A330 routes. Those MAS executives really need a spank or two. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Min Chun 0 Report post Posted March 8, 2006 waht a bloody stupid move MAS....keep those 747-400...ur making a silly move by selling it. sell the 330's. i personally think , the A380 is a waste of time. Like ppl will say, too big for the dustbin. Get the 787 instead. PLEASE , PLEASE think Mr.Idris....i wouldnt wana be flying to sydney all the time in a smaller plane. Yeap..sell 330 and keep 747! instead, MH can buy 787 or 773ER! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tze Shan 0 Report post Posted March 8, 2006 well, in my opinion, i think Idris made a wrong decision to sell off staff and fleet as we know, plane and pilot both are the most important asset for an airways rite?? if he sell off a/c, wat he wanna use to earn $$? bus? train? or sailing? I studied "PA" , although it is under "badan tidak berkanun" but it just like petronas!, goverment will collect a large number of tax from them, while "proton" was having problem last time, goverment can subsidise them but why not give Mh a help now also? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Isaac 0 Report post Posted March 8, 2006 (edited) I am no expert in fleet planning but i think MAS should keep only 11-12 744 for the following flights : - 2x daily LHR - 2x daily SYD - 2x daily MEL - 1x daily CDG Get rid of all 333. Reconfigurate at least half (or more) of the 772 to high-density configuration serving some of the current 333 destinations such as BKK, HKG, BOM, DEL, PVG, PER etc. 45" of pitch for GCC will be good enough (on par with CX for regional sectors) and keep the 34" of pitch for EY. Reduce the numbers of galley also ...... MH just don't need so many galleys for regional flights. Deploy 772 to the following cities : - AMS (If the load is really good, then MAS can consider to introduce a 2nd daily 772 flight) - AKL - BNE - FRA - FCO - NRT - KIX - ICN Approach both Airbus & Boeing for new orders. I personally think 787 suits MAS better, and the 77W also. MAS should not only sell 6 - 9 of their 734 but ALL OF THEM. Replace them with either 320 or 738 (i prefer the later one ). Good luck MH ! Edited March 8, 2006 by Isaac Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KC Sim 2 Report post Posted March 8, 2006 When an airline is faced with hard times like this, it has to swallow a huge bitter pill. And if hiving off a significant portion of the B744 fleet ensures sustainability, then so be it. MAS (and Malaysians in general) should conduct business that is economically viable . . . and not just for prestige. I salute the current management for having the guts to take all these measures and I am certain that several years down the road (if MAS is able to stick to its Turnaround Plan), all Malaysians will be proud of what it has done and achieved. As for the A380 order, perhaps MAS should swap delivery slots with airlines that are keen to have earlier deliveries . . . and then accept these later than originally planned. By then, it could perhaps justify having these in the fleet. But if economic reality means that this order should be cancelled . . . then there is no point blindly joining the A380 Club. KC Sim Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Fendy Report post Posted March 8, 2006 and 320 is a must buy to compete with AK. love those aircraft. simple.... a. pay rm300 for return trip to PEN on mh seven three four; or b. pay rm200 for similar trip on AK's three twenty.... no brainer to choose better deal...... mh got orange juice wor... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TW Teo 0 Report post Posted March 8, 2006 (edited) Is getting rid of the B747 that good an idea, especially with the A380 coming? I agree that the B777's are the way to go.. and they should probably invest in a few more in coming years, either that or with B787s or A350s.. that seems to be the way to go... and if possible, later on maybe some B748 to supplement and replace the B747s in teh fleet with aircraft of similar size with better fuel economy. my view anyways.. Perhaps that's exactly what they're doing! Replacing the 747 fleet with the A380s (which has a slightly better CASM) and replacing routes which do not need such capacity with the 777s and A330s. Seems almost exactly like what SQ is doing... Edited March 8, 2006 by TW Teo Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TK 0 Report post Posted March 8, 2006 which is a cheaper plane to operate....????? 777 full load to LHR or 747??? have you guys ever check the statistic of pax load on the 3rd LHR flight???? almost 40 % only...most if the time....so sending the 777 for such flights are better. Japan Airline...no more 747 from NRT to LHR....they use the 777-300ER. Actually MH can do with the 777 to LHR everyday...anytime!! cheaper! Where is LeeCH....SQ 777....does it belongs to SALE or Singapore Airlines??? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Seth K 3 Report post Posted March 8, 2006 mh got orange juice wor... Eventually pay RM100 more for a glass of Orange Juice and Two pack of Yupi(IIRC)............. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sandeep G 1 Report post Posted March 9, 2006 Let the new management sell the planes... even though I think 12/13 744s is a tad bit extreme... another option could be for them to remove all their newly refurbished 744 seats and install them on the A333 fleet???? Who knows... Also.. do we have to get rid of them??? MH from my last count is using at least 6 wet-leased freighters from Air Atlanta Icelandic.. THEY ARE COSTING A BOMB!! Convert all our unwanted 744s into freighters (look at the CX 744BCF) and put them online with MASKargo and send those 742s back to icey-iceland with a thanks, but no thanks memo! Then, we can use our existing pool of pilots who are MALAYSIANS to fly, and not have to pay RM 700,000 for a western pilot!.. and we'll already have the maintenance capabilities for the aircraft.. AND we could possibly become an expert in BCFs thereby creating a nice new market for our Engineering department to market themselves as plenty of 744 PAX versions are to be converted to freighters in this way... just my 2 sen.. The following is how I envisage MAS future ops... key markets with higher frequencies and suitable aircraft. KUL-LHR should be served by at least one daily 744 and the other a 777 and if there is going to be a third, then that should be 777 also.. Eventually once daily A380, twice daily 744 once the market builds up with new pricing regime??? Also, think about operating some services out of LGW?? lower cost? LHR is a bitch for slots and LGW has more CO flights for connection with MH in the case that MH joins Skyteam.. KUL-MAN A DAILY 777 service is much needed.. I think this route is quite profitable.. if they want to lower costs and be a market creator, the former RAF Finningley and now Robin Hood Airport at Doncaster in Yorkshire is a place to consider for intercontinental travel between UK and Asia.. they have the required Runway as Vulcans use to be based there... Market is huge.. Doncaster, Sheffield, Newcastle and Manchester is just a stones throw away... KUL-AMS DOUBLE DAILY 744 service.. LONG overdue! Skyteam will be more than happy! Eventually DOUBLE DAILY A380 service.. can use NW, KL and CO services to East coast USA/Canada! even KL services to other destinations in Europe. KUL-CDG DAILY 744 service, DAILY 777 Service... eventually daily A380 service and DAILY 777 Service.. Skyteam again! KUL-FRA Daily A332 service... it's Germany! We have a lot of trade with Germany.. price the tickets more effectively.. and stop the Germans from boarding SQ flights or LH flight via SIN/BGK! KUL-FCO.. 5 times weekly A332 service KUL-ZRH.. Daily A332 service, hey afterall, all those local big shots will have to visit their money is Switzerland somehow! KUL-DXB.. Double Daily A333 service* KUL-IST-BEY.. Keep the route.. maybe make it daily with A333* KUL-JED.. Daily A333* KUL-CAI.. Daily A332 KUL-AMM.. Daily A333* KUL-TPE-LAX should be a 777 definately!! KUL-STO-NYC should remain a 777... I still feel with promotion of this sector and Malaysia as a tourist destination, MH can consider putting these flights to daily.. KUL-SYD/MEL. definately need to retain the 744 service at least once a day! KUL-PER.. double daily 777/A330 combined service... or even twice daily A333 service* KUL-ADL.. OK, I believe they are going to start 744 services here... why? ADL needs a daily A333 service* KUL-BNE.. Daily A333 service*.. KUL-EZE.. ermm... this one still puzzles me... if this sector is going to remain to bring in Argentinean steaks for the Argentinean Steakhouse (Jln. P. Ramlee, KL - Next to beach club).. then I guess a 744... 777 would make more sense.. but we need the 777 elsewhere... KUL-DEL.. DOUBLE DAILY 777!!! KUL-MAA.. TRIPLE DAILY A333!!! KUL-HYD.. Existing A333 frequency.. or daily B738* KUL-AHM.. ditto as HYD KUL-CCU.. ditto as HYD KUL-BOM.. DOUBLE DAILY 777!!! KUL-HKG.. Seem ok.. but will probably have to replace the 744 service... KUL-CAN.. DOUBLE DAILY A333 service*... if they are joiing Skyteam, then THRICE or QUAD flights daily to use their network to feed traffic to other smaller Chinese cities.. Hurry up with the Alliance MH KUL-PDG.. DOUBLE DAILY 777 service KUL-XIY.. Daily B738* KUL-XMN.. Daily B738* KUL-PEK.. DOUBLE DAILY 777 service KUL-NRT.. THRICE DAILY 777 service.. start selling more golf tour packages of Malaysia, Golden Holidays KUL-KIX.. Double daily A333 service* KUL-ICN.. DOUBLE DAILY 777.. if skyteam blossoms I think it should then be 3 times... we can use KEs links across to the USA.. then MAS need not panic about filling flights.. heck.. MH might even be granted to fly from ICN- West coast USA/Canada... a much more bigger market than TPE-USA... another reason why the alliance is so important... *A330-300 cabin should be upgraded in the next 12 months to allow for competition with our competitors... THIS IS A MUST! And Get rid of MKR.. it's absolutely useless IMHO. Personally, I think another 5 777s should be added to the fleet with focus on maybe adding even more in the future.. Maybe even order some additional NEW A330-300s with new cabin design from Airbus.. And B734 replacement should be accelerated!! We need some longer range small aircraft... 737-900ER or even the 737-700ER are contestants.. the 738 fills the gap nicely! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kandiah k 0 Report post Posted March 9, 2006 KUL-FRA Daily A332 service... it's Germany! We have a lot of trade with Germany.. price the tickets more effectively.. and stop the Germans from boarding SQ flights or LH flight via SIN/BGK! KUL-FCO.. 5 times weekly A332 service KUL-ZRH.. Daily A332 service, hey afterall, all those local big shots will have to visit their money is Switzerland somehow! Can an A332 fly these distances and routes ? KUL-TPE-LAX should be a 777 definately!! KUL-STO-NYC should remain a 777... I still feel with promotion of this sector and Malaysia as a tourist destination, MH can consider putting these flights to daily.. (the flights were full on the EWR-ARN-KUL March 4th 2006 to the brim) KUL-MAA.. TRIPLE DAILY A333!!! (are you sure they can do triple daily ? 9W and IC already sucking out pax from MH with low fares) [*A330-300 cabin should be upgraded in the next 12 months to allow for competition with our competitors... THIS IS A MUST! And Get rid of MKR.. it's absolutely useless IMHO. Personally, I think another 5 777s should be added to the fleet with focus on maybe adding even more in the future.. Maybe even order some additional NEW A330-300s with new cabin design from Airbus.. And B734 replacement should be accelerated!! We need some longer range small aircraft... 737-900ER or even the 737-700ER are contestants.. the 738 fills the gap nicely! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andrew K 0 Report post Posted March 9, 2006 "KUL-CDG DAILY 744 service, DAILY 777 Service... eventually daily A380 service and DAILY 777 Service.. Skyteam again!" Not a little too much? "KUL-TPE-LAX should be a 777 definately!!" I agree completely. Btw, is it that much of a pain to install the old gcc seats from the 777's to the a330's? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Edwin Yii 0 Report post Posted March 9, 2006 (edited) well i'm still wondering from Sandeep post..why hire foreign pilots when we can train out our own pilots? hint* more flight schools! Edited March 9, 2006 by Edwin Yii Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Seth K 3 Report post Posted March 9, 2006 KUL-NRT.. THRICE DAILY 777 service.. start selling more golf tour packages of Malaysia, Golden Holidays I don't know about NRT that much, but I did flew this route 4 years ago, the flight time was 11PM, iirc..........thinking of changing it Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pieter C. 5 Report post Posted March 9, 2006 Deploy 772 to the following cities : - AMS (If the load is really good, then MAS can consider to introduce a 2nd daily 772 flight) Isaac, AMS 744's are always full (don't know the yield, though), and 2x 777 is more expensive than 1x 744 a day... so.........keep the 744 for the time being, or, as the Dutch paper De Telegraaf reported " Idris Jala had talks with Leo van Wijk, about a alliance with KLM"...KLM could, in that case, operate an extra flight and operate the route like KL and NW do trans-atlantic... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Imran K. 0 Report post Posted March 9, 2006 I agree with Sandeep with regards to the overdue refurbishment of MAS' A330-300's. Personally, they are ABSOLUTELY horrible. I'd rather fly Yemenia's A330's nowadays... <_> Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
S V Choong 4 Report post Posted March 9, 2006 Perhaps that's exactly what they're doing! Replacing the 747 fleet with the A380s (which has a slightly better CASM) and replacing routes which do not need such capacity with the 777s and A330s. Seems almost exactly like what SQ is doing... A380 is not a direct replacement of 744. The A380 is good for high density routes like KUL-LHR and KUL-SYD with good load and limited slots. The A380 carries more passengers than the 744. SQ is replacing some of their 744 with the A380 with peak routes and the rest by 77W (777-300ER). Even then, the 777-300ER is not a direct replacement of the 744 as it doesn't fill as much passenger as the 744 is able to. It is only a more economical option. Perhaps Boeing re-introduced the 747-8 for this very reason. I don't know whether it is worth to introduce the A380s as the introduction costs will be quite high and given the current situation, MAS is better off keeping what they have - the 744 and boot out the A380s. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KK Lee 5 Report post Posted March 9, 2006 I agree with Sandeep with regards to the overdue refurbishment of MAS' A330-300's. Personally, they are ABSOLUTELY horrible. I'd rather fly Yemenia's A330's nowadays... <_> When I travelled on MH333, I need to exchange seat cushion with another seat half of the time (if the flight is not full) else have to suffer deflated seat for 3 hours. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TW Teo 0 Report post Posted March 9, 2006 A380 is not a direct replacement of 744. The A380 is good for high density routes like KUL-LHR and KUL-SYD with good load and limited slots. The A380 carries more passengers than the 744. SQ is replacing some of their 744 with the A380 with peak routes and the rest by 77W (777-300ER). Even then, the 777-300ER is not a direct replacement of the 744 as it doesn't fill as much passenger as the 744 is able to. It is only a more economical option. Perhaps Boeing re-introduced the 747-8 for this very reason. I don't know whether it is worth to introduce the A380s as the introduction costs will be quite high and given the current situation, MAS is better off keeping what they have - the 744 and boot out the A380s. They're not... but replacing 12 to 13 747s with 6 A380s for their peak routes seems sensible with the proposed route cutbacks. They're better off with less aircraft than flying them empty. But then again, we don't really know what the real costs are like and what kind of deal MAS has with Airbus. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
