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Jim Liu

Malaysia Airlines creates a no-child zone

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In case of emergency and evacuation, it will be much easier to jump the slides (with children) from the lower deck which is lower and less steep.

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S V Choong: No parents will ever say negative things about their kids to the general public (or friends), even if their kids are misbehaving and uncontrollable at home. It's all about "pride" and not willing to admit the problem of not being good parents.

 

Yes, not all kids act like that, and you can call MH's policy discriminatory whatever you want even if it doesn't make sense. However, if a family travels with babies that cries on board or uncontrollable kids on the plane, they are discriminating other people by taking other people's rights to comfort away.

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S V Choong: No parents will ever say negative things about their kids to the general public (or friends), even if their kids are misbehaving and uncontrollable at home. It's all about "pride" and not willing to admit the problem of not being good parents.

 

Yes, not all kids act like that, and you can call MH's policy discriminatory whatever you want even if it doesn't make sense. However, if a family travels with babies that cries on board or uncontrollable kids on the plane, they are discriminating other people by taking other people's rights to comfort away.

Okay let's say in the past I have been sitting next to some say mainland Chinese who talks loudly or being pushy and even put up their smelly feet with the smelly socks on. So, if the airlines get enough nods, they can write no mainland Chinese allowed in this restricted area? Is this the logic behind this? Don't forget there are adults that behave like brats if you recline your seats you get pushed from behind you. Adults that snores loudly on the plane.... The list can go on.

 

When traveling with others, you are expected to share your comfort. I don't really believe your can really enjoy all the comfort you want to! If people really want all the comfort, they can pay more to upgrade which is what most people do and even so, they are not guaranteed they can enjoy all the stuff they paid for.

 

Other airlines are not doing this because they can smell trouble in doing so in their country. Heck fat people are not even expected to buy two seats and airlines don't do this for a good reason. Think about it from a more neutral position rather than your interests.

 

In the old days, this "debate" would not even be possible because seating arrangements are the prerogative of the airline. We are now so spoilt these days that we are behaving like brats when we cannot get a seat of our choice!

Would you rather go back to the good old days and lived under the more authoritarian lifestyle then?

Edited by S V Choong

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Okay let's say in the past I have been sitting next to some say mainland Chinese who talks loudly or being pushy and even put up their smelly feet with the smelly socks on. So, if the airlines get enough nods, they can write no mainland Chinese allowed in this restricted area?

Oooh...how tempting... :diablo:

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I'm quite sure this policy will alienate some passengers, and attract others. Hopefully MH will be able to attract more than what they will lose.

 

You just can't have it right for everybody.

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Would you rather go back to the good old days and lived under the more authoritarian lifestyle then?

Yes, why not? It would be a nice change. Discipline is fast disappearing in this country and this would be a small step to remind people that sometimes, rules need to be enforced for safety and good of all who are travelling in the aircraft.

 

When I was visiting Taiwan/Japan I was very appreciative of the peace and quiet we had on the Shinkansen and HSR services. Their conditions of carriage are much stricter than what we see on MH.

 

BTW, even Singapore Airlines' latest A380s no longer feature economy class on the upper decks. So, airlines are starting to make the top deck to give better yields on long haul flights.

 

I'm quite sure this policy will alienate some passengers, and attract others. Hopefully MH will be able to attract more than what they will lose.

 

You just can't have it right for everybody.

Yes you cannot please all people all of the time. I think Richard Quest (CNN) was very surprised by the reaction of people to this piece of news. People are either strongly for or strongly against. I guess your point of view depends on what kind of pax you are. There isn't any middle ground opinion on this issue.

Edited by flee

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S V Choong, you raised few valid issues. But given you already posed your opposition to this idea and calling it discrimination, raising these issues makes you looks like you're playing the blame game. I hope you don't teach your kids blaming other people when things doesn't go in your favour.

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So, from what we've heard/read so far on the A380:

1.No babies (no bassinets installed) in First class.

2.No restrictions for babies and children in Business class (bassinets provided).

3.No babies and children under 12 on the upper deck in Economy.

4.No restrictions on lower deck of Economy.

 

 

 

MH is to ban babies and children from business class next? Else how could business class pax benefit from quiet environment?

:sorry:

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S V Choong: No parents will ever say negative things about their kids to the general public (or friends), even if their kids are misbehaving and uncontrollable at home. It's all about "pride" and not willing to admit the problem of not being good parents.

That's not true. May be it applies to half of the parents in the world but there certainly are also many parents that won't have a second thought to b***h about their out-of-control kids/teenage kids in front of others. And not all parents will boast about something that their kids are not/can't do like what some movies portray :)

 

 

Other airlines are not doing this because they can smell trouble in doing so in their country. Heck fat people are not even expected to buy two seats and airlines don't do this for a good reason. Think about it from a more neutral position rather than your interests.

Actually, Southwest Airlines does have this kind of policy. It was even filmed into a documentary. I still have the DVD somewhere in my house. Can't recall what's the title of the documentary already...

 

 

I'm quite sure this policy will alienate some passengers, and attract others. Hopefully MH will be able to attract more than what they will lose.

 

You just can't have it right for everybody.

Spot on!

 

 

When I was visiting Taiwan/Japan I was very appreciative of the peace and quiet we had on the Shinkansen and HSR services. Their conditions of carriage are much stricter than what we see on MH.

Agreed! Everyone totally behaves themselves! :good:

 

 

BTW, even Singapore Airlines' latest A380s no longer feature economy class on the upper decks. So, airlines are starting to make the top deck to give better yields on long haul flights.

Has it been confirmed that they will refurbish all the old 388 featuring Y on the upper deck to the new configuration ? Sorry, didn't follow that announcement closely.

 

 

Yes you cannot please all people all of the time. I think Richard Quest (CNN) was very surprised by the reaction of people to this piece of news. People are either strongly for or strongly against. I guess your point of view depends on what kind of pax you are. There isn't any middle ground opinion on this issue.

It's been reported into CNN Business Traveller already ? Anyway, it's just like Richard Quest. Some people like him, some don't. Some people even complain about his strong accent amongst many other things simply because they do not like him (what???).

 

 

MH is to ban babies and children from business class next? Else how could business class pax benefit from quiet environment?

:sorry:

Agreed. It's quite contradicting indeed! :unknw:

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In case of emergency and evacuation, it will be much easier to jump the slides (with children) from the lower deck which is lower and less steep.

 

That's a very stoooooopid reason. Perhaps one should just stay at home to avoid "crash & burn" events...

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Try jumping the slides then you can decide whether it's stupid or not. Anyways it was more of tongue in cheek reasoning, my bad for not putting a smilie or something.

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I'm all for this idea. These days more and more people flying for business purposes are sitting at the back of the bus. Therefore, this is a very good idea

 

Btw, would you think that some airlines actually place all these small children in a certain section of the aircraft ? Somehow I don't come across screaming children on my flights on SQ.

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i have 2 kids, and i agreed that's a good idea for MH for dooing so, which passanger would able to choose for no children cabin or family cabin...we have to put our feet in people shoes, which we all prefer a quite journey which we can rest peacefully througout the journey...and as a parents, i also feel bad and shame when my kids cries and disturb others. but i hope that the travellers can understand why the kids crying, sometime the cabin pressure making the kids really uncomfortable, and the change of pressure will make the ear painful...

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I have got friends who drug their kids with sedating cough syrups prior to a flight, even for KUL-KCH flights. Shockingly they are pediatricians..

 

For my own use, I invest in noise canceling headphones to snuff off the noise.

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I have got friends who drug their kids with sedating cough syrups prior to a flight, even for KUL-KCH flights. Shockingly they are pediatricians..

 

For my own use, I invest in noise canceling headphones to snuff off the noise.

 

Haha. I know a doctor who drugs herself on every long-haul flight.

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Haha. I know a doctor who drugs herself on every long-haul flight.

 

With alcohol?

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My impression is that this 'no child zone' thing is being used to create a sense of exclusivity - good marketing move

But having such policy in place, MH also need to make very sure the check in staff/agents have very clear and strict guidelines to adhere to - the consequences otherwise may be disputes galore, more than negating any marketing advantage :)

Edited by BC Tam

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That's not true. May be it applies to half of the parents in the world but there certainly are also many parents that won't have a second thought to b***h about their out-of-control kids/teenage kids in front of others. And not all parents will boast about something that their kids are not/can't do like what some movies portray :)

 

That only applies to those kids who are in extremely out of control situation, otherwise parents refuse to admit they can't control their kids unless they're "done" with them.

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That only applies to those kids who are in extremely out of control situation, otherwise parents refuse to admit they can't control their kids unless they're "done" with them.

Not really... or perhaps things are different in Malaysia. There are many parents who complain about their straight As kids that they are never punctual, lazy (refuse to do house chores for example), so polite in front of other people but a total person when they are with their parents...

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Excellent news. Most premium airlines already seat most young families at the rear of the plane (easy for priority boarding too) so I find this no different. Except that MH has used it as a marketing advantage which is a big plus.

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Not really... or perhaps things are different in Malaysia. There are many parents who complain about their straight As kids that they are never punctual, lazy (refuse to do house chores for example), so polite in front of other people but a total person when they are with their parents...

Yup that is true. Jim I think you have gone overboard alightly. I think you are within the self gloating and nearly in the personal attack territory. I just came back from Sydney and our flight were full of kids below 3 years old (incl. ours)There were occasional cries but nobody wreck havoc on the plane. Nope I don't spank my kids in front of others to give them the pleasure of viewing like many parents in Malaysia do. Sorry somehow not knowing people personally but endlessly come out theory of your own doesn't help. Perhaps you are speaking from your own experience?

 

I am not going to debate whether MH doing this is a good idea or not. We should agree to disagree. For me, I will be enjoying my flights with the stylish bird airline on the upper deck Economy or biz class. Yes we have done that before on our SIN-NRT flights with our 1 year old on the upper deck :).

 

MH is to ban babies and children from business class next? Else how could business class pax benefit from quiet environment?

:sorry:

Creating a new biz class section on the lower deck?

 

 

Oooh...how tempting... :diablo:

 

Sure is.... Some mainland idiots were trying to claim my foot rest space when I wasn't using it. Had to tell him to f.o. See we are actually at the mercy of the pax around us. If you pay more you get more of these rights, simple economics.

Edited by S V Choong

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Personally, I do not know if this is a good or a bad policy. Not having kids myself, while I am apprehensive about having them nearby, I am also sympathetic to parents trying their best to calm their kids down in airplanes. Sadly, many parents do not understand why kids scream in pain - especially during landing. I was on a B727 flight operated by MIAT Mogolian Airlines and this 40-something year old stewardess noticed a young mother struggling with her very small baby which was screaming loudly. She came up and put her mouth to the ear of the baby - and I do not know if she blew into its ears or sucked it - and voila, the kid was calm. Apparently it is something to do with equalising the pressure in the ear and easing the pain in it. I personally take a piece of tissue paper and blow my nose into it to restore the pressure in my ears.

 

While this policy will appease those who dislike having children that inevitably make noise nearby, it would turn off those with children. And with this policy, I can now imagine another category of passengers sitting on the upper deck of the A380 who will complain loudly to the crew if they see any kids there - even if the kids are well-behaved, simply because the rule clearly states that no kids on the upper deck! And they don't even realise that they are perhaps as irritating as any kid could potentially be.

 

What would be the situation if a family wants to travel on an A380 flight ... and all seats on the main deck have already been either allocated or requested for by passengers already booked to fly ... and there are still unsold seats on the upper deck? Will the airline move passengers with pre-allocated or pre-requested seats on the main deck to the upper deck just so that it could accept the booking of this family on the main deck? If yes, does it not upset those who have to move to the upper deck (I personally do not like the upper deck) because they may have elected to sit on the main deck for specific reasons? If MAS does not move the main deck passengers without children to the upper deck just so it could sell seats on the main deck to the family, it would be staring at lost business.

 

Perhaps it might be better for MAS to (internally) agree to where possible not have children on the upper deck ... and as far as possible up to the check-in stage, keep families with children on the main deck but if really need to, then judiciously place only families with older toddlers on the upper deck. That way, the airline has sufficient flexibility to keep its upper deck more exclusive, manage its yield and passenger load factor and avoid having its crew members caught between a rock and a hard place.

 

I agree with an earlier post that noise-cancelling headphones are a great tool to insulate oneself from screaming kids and babies ... I don't like such headphones as it gets rather hot around the ear after a while but find solace and serenity in the type that sticks into the ear channel and then turning on the music softly. That way, I have survived many screaming episodes and never needed to give these poor parents struggling to appease their babies the dirty look. It is tough enough being parents to babies and young kids ... and they don't need the additional pressures of sarcastic calls, dirty looks and other negative signals from fellow passengers. Now they have an airline that does not want them in certain parts of the aircraft.

 

KC Sim

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Actually, having flown on more than 60 airlines since 1981 ... I must say that my greatest irritations have been with grown-ups rather than children.

 

Some of these include :

 

- people who MUST stand on the aisle to talk to the friends seated (even as the seat next to their friend is empty). They just MUST be seen ... never mind how many times the crew needed to move up and down the aisle during meal service.

- people who stand in the aisle while a movie is on the main screen (in the days before IFE is common) ... I once had to ask a lady if she intended to stand all the way to London ... she sat down at lightning speed after that and other passengers applauded

- people who play footsie with you by placing their feet in the space beneath the seat in front of me ... I had to tell such people to keep their feet in front of them and if I want to play footsie, I will invite them to do so

- people who recline their seats violently as soon as they finish gobbling down their meal ... and those who do so even before the flight has taken off

- people who rest their hairy arms beyond the armrests ... I truly dislike this and will therefore avoid airlines with 10-abreast B777s such as EK

- people who talk loudly about all their life achievements ... even as their friend's ear is less than a foot from their lips

- people who stand on the aisle or next to the emergency exit to do bending and stretching exercises in a showy manner. I once saw this man who wore an almost-Christmassy outfit doing almost erotic stretches ...

- people who push against the back of your seat when they get out of theirs or when they walk past you in the aisle ... this happened to me throughout my flight on Olympic Airways from BKK to ATH and again on the way back! Recently on my Finnair flight from HEL to SIN, it happened again - they don't seem to need any sleep at any stage of a flight lasting longer than 12 hours.

- people who break wind continually or burp or suck their teeth for a long time after their meals ...

 

Actually, there are lots more instances of irritating grown-ups than I could list right now ...

 

KC Sim

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