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Mohd Hazman

Need Some Advices/Opinions/Thoughts

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Hi there everyone.

 

Im going to make it simple straight forward here. I'm a cadet pilot(private)of a local flying school here. About to graduate in 2 more weeks.

 

I'm very worried of not able to secure a job thereafter with our current aviation state. I'm aware that the big names like FY, AK, and even MAS are expanding their fleets as we speaking but to me the competition is very stiff.

 

Whilst giving a shot on direct intakes and what not, I was told by a friend that we ( the fresh grads) can opt to go to Indonesia, for type rating(on our own expense) and a job is guaranteed for us there. With B737 rating offered there and seeing that the opportunity is there, I was thinking, why not??

 

BUT, a big doubt here is...Well we all know that Indonesia got some safety issues on their aviation line...SO, I am wondering whether the HOURS I clocked flying there are going to be recognized by other airlines(outside Indo)if I am to hoop on later on?

 

Been trying to find the answer quite some time... Seem Most of you here are old-timer in this industry, I was thinking you guys might want to give a hand to this poor kid trying to dig some hole searching for a light for the sake of his future.... Thanks! =)

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BUT, a big doubt here is...Well we all know that Indonesia got some safety issues on their aviation line...SO, I am wondering whether the HOURS I clocked flying there are going to be recognized by other airlines(outside Indo)if I am to hoop on later on?

 

Indonesian safety issues are different to recognition of logged hours; all your hours logged in a ICAO recognized country should be recognized by all airlines...therefore, many Malaysian pilots now fly in the UAE or Aussie pilots in HKG or French pilots in Viet Nam...

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Your concern is quite universal for most people making transition from academia to the real world :)

And I see a new term has been spawned, "draduate"; the dread to graduate ? :p

Edited by BC Tam

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Indonesian safety issues are different to recognition of logged hours; all your hours logged in a ICAO recognized country should be recognized by all airlines...therefore, many Malaysian pilots now fly in the UAE or Aussie pilots in HKG or French pilots in Viet Nam...

 

I see... Is Indonesia an ICAO recognized country then? I could see(and hear) that some of AK and MH pilots are indeed indonesian though... Is your previous company would be an issue if you are to go to another company in the future? I mean, yeah I heard UAE loves Malaysian pilots...but would they love Indonesian pilots too? Maybe this is too early for me but, I think its good to know before you proceed rather than going in blind right? thanks.

 

Your concern is quite universal for most people making transition from academia to the real world :)

And I see a new term has been spawned, "draduate"; the dread to graduate ? :p

 

The transition is kinda....scary...that "draduate" was a typo but its such a beautiful coincidence isn't it? lol =)

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Getting a job is the highest priority of all rather than be choosy and end up jobless.

 

Yes, safety is an issue in Indonesia ......... it is a fact ..... however, you have to ask yourself whether you are prepared to face the challenges or would rather follow the flow and become one of them?

 

If I am in the same shoe, I would accept any 'reasonable' offer (e.g B737NG/Airbus ratings, reasonable salary), get the type rating, clock as many hours as possible, fulfill your contract obligation and leave to a greener field.

 

Whether in Indonesia, Malaysia or Siberia, flying hours are still flying hours as long as your logbook is certified by an appropriate authority.

 

 

:hi:

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Indonesia is listed! Great! Thanks! :yahoo:

 

 

Getting a job is the highest priority of all rather than be choosy and end up jobless.

 

Yes, safety is an issue in Indonesia ......... it is a fact ..... however, you have to ask yourself whether you are prepared to face the challenges or would rather follow the flow and become one of them?

 

If I am in the same shoe, I would accept any 'reasonable' offer (e.g B737NG/Airbus ratings, reasonable salary), get the type rating, clock as many hours as possible, fulfill your contract obligation and leave to a greener field.

 

Whether in Indonesia, Malaysia or Siberia, flying hours are still flying hours as long as your logbook is certified by an appropriate authority.

 

 

:hi:

 

Exactly what I am looking for. Yup, getting the job is the highest priority indeed. WILCO, thanks! :good:

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Thats what it seems to be for the next FEW years...true, but can't wait for the FEW years to come by without doing nothing...Or maybe hopefully those FEW years will start next year itself. finger crossed.

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Mohmd do you mind if I ask what your total multi experience, and in what, will be when you hope to jump straight into the RH seat of a commercial airliner carrying 150 pax.

 

No disrespect but whatever happened to the PPL, CPL, and then conversion routes? The more I fly as a pax these days and see what looks like wet behind the ears flight crew I worry. And please don't go for the Airbus. I want a pilot not a computer manager who has no idea of how to fly using raw data when it all goes pear shaped. There are far too many 'follow the magenta line' brigade these days.

 

As you may have noticed I learned by the self improvement way :p

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Once I graduate from the academy I'll be having 165 hours in single engine & 35hours of twin ( including 10 hours sim ) and thats it. And there's no multi- crew experience there except that we are trained for multi crew environment. With our current aviation condition, I know that I cant afford to be choosy in making out for the job and that is why I am trying to pull out every possibility and chances that is there for me as earliest as possible.

 

Im a private cadet and there's a heck of a loan to pay regardless of whether or not I managed to secure a job later. Personally I agree with you regarding the airbus thing but then again, cant be choosy though.... If its gotta be "computer manager" for me, then I guess I'll just stick with the flow. I do love boeing personally, even 747 arouses me more than the fat 380...

 

here in my academy, we are still using old piper aircrafts which mean all that we have is analogue compared to those school having Diamonds for their training with the glass cockpit and GPS. We go for nav at 2000ft where we can maintain visual with the terrain whilst those guys climb to almost 10000ft into the clouds and can happily navigate with their instruments ( although not so computer-managed)but still...

 

All I got in mind right now is to finish this course ASAP then start hunting for the job. My thoughts are:

 

1. Direct Entry ( Local Airlines -FY,AK,MH, Maswing, Berjaya Air???)

2. Direct Entry ( Via Pay- yourself- for-the-type-rating) maybe Indonesia, that is why Im trying to make it clear here

3. AFI ( Well, this is my final resort. If I have to start my career this way then, I guess I'll do it.

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all that we have is analogue

 

Mohd, absolutely nothing wrong with that! Using analogue instruments when IMC is the only way to learn how to fly on instruments. How many in the Diamond with the glass cockpit can enter and fly a hold using an RMI/RBI and a stopwatch.... not many I'll bet.

 

I trained for my PPL in a PA28 and moved onto an Aztech (PA27) a very stable aircraft, a bit ponderous but I managed over a 1000 hours in one. I then moved onto the Navajo (PA31-350) and flew for a small outfit back in the UK.

 

Good luck with your career.

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All I got in mind right now is to finish this course ASAP then start hunting for the job. My thoughts are:

 

1. Direct Entry ( Local Airlines -FY,AK,MH, Maswing, Berjaya Air???)

2. Direct Entry ( Via Pay- yourself- for-the-type-rating) maybe Indonesia, that is why Im trying to make it clear here

3. AFI ( Well, this is my final resort. If I have to start my career this way then, I guess I'll do it.

 

My view is if you gotta pay something for further training, I'll pay for AFI course and clock up the hours that way. I think an airline is more willing to take a pilot with hours and instructor rating rather than type rating with insufficient hours. I've also heard a lot from my flying instructor friends that their flying improved so much more once they are instructors. The risk with pay-yourself-for-the-type-rating is that there is still no guarantee that you'll get a job after sinking so much $$$ into it. Though no guarantee with AFI as well, but I think the chances are better, together with your hours up. I am also looking for an AFI course and I may even make flight instructing a long-term career rather than being a computer / machine operator.

Edited by alberttky

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Mohd, absolutely nothing wrong with that! Using analogue instruments when IMC is the only way to learn how to fly on instruments. How many in the Diamond with the glass cockpit can enter and fly a hold using an RMI/RBI and a stopwatch.... not many I'll bet.

 

I trained for my PPL in a PA28 and moved onto an Aztech (PA27) a very stable aircraft, a bit ponderous but I managed over a 1000 hours in one. I then moved onto the Navajo (PA31-350) and flew for a small outfit back in the UK.

Good luck with your career.

 

Wow! Great experiences you got there! 1000hours in that type huh? are you working for some charter or so? For me, got my PPL in PA28 and now im with PA34-220. They are aged, but they are still a great thing to fly and love them so much! hehe...thanks mate!

 

My view is if you gotta pay something for further training, I'll pay for AFI course and clock up the hours that way. I think an airline is more willing to take a pilot with hours and instructor rating rather than type rating with insufficient hours. I've also heard a lot from my flying instructor friends that their flying improved so much more once they are instructors. The risk with pay-yourself-for-the-type-rating is that there is still no guarantee that you'll get a job after sinking so much $$$ into it. Though no guarantee with AFI as well, but I think the chances are better, together with your hours up. I am also looking for an AFI course and I may even make flight instructing a long-term career rather than being a computer / machine operator.

 

I thought of that too but...That particular pay-yourself-for-the-type-rating I meant was the one in Indonesia where it is said that a job is GUARANTEED for you?! So I was thinking, if I got the money, why not invest to something that promises you a career and what important here is the hours collected thereafter.

 

Regarding the AFI course, I think Asia Pacific Flight Training in Kelantan might be looking for some. I heard they just bought 10 new PA28s for that matter. You might want to try it over there but many are reluctant to work there just because of, i dont know, they said there no life there. But i guess its all on ones point of view right? Good Luck man!

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I thought of that too but...That particular pay-yourself-for-the-type-rating I meant was the one in Indonesia where it is said that a job is GUARANTEED for you?! So I was thinking, if I got the money, why not invest to something that promises you a career and what important here is the hours collected thereafter.

 

Regarding the AFI course, I think Asia Pacific Flight Training in Kelantan might be looking for some. I heard they just bought 10 new PA28s for that matter. You might want to try it over there but many are reluctant to work there just because of, i dont know, they said there no life there. But i guess its all on ones point of view right? Good Luck man!

 

I've just accepted an offer for a ground job so I will do that while saving up $$ for my instructor course. Will consider APFT, life or no life it doesn't really matter lah... I was training in a small kampung in England and that's got no life too.

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Now that I'm making up my mind to go for indonesian airline, there are few people out there giving me negatives responses of not to go there due to safety issues over there mainly. What do you people think? How do you convince those people regarding this? Help please. thanks.

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I would suggest u to go, but just ensure the company u'll be joining is fully recognised by authorities and preferably big,popular company.. No point going so far/risky by flying people with kambing in remote area,operate from un-ATC airstrip flying jurassic aircraft...

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I would suggest u to go, but just ensure the company u'll be joining is fully recognised by authorities and preferably big,popular company.. No point going so far/risky by flying people with kambing in remote area,operate from un-ATC airstrip flying jurassic aircraft...

 

Of Course the particular company has its own recognition among the airlines. Its just that the thinking and impressions of these peoples about Airlines in indonesia is bad in the first place. Kinda difficult to convince them....

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Get yourself CONVINCED and forget about others ...... :rolleyes:

 

Your career, your rice bowl and your future ....... :rofl:

 

Learn as much as you could and be safe .......... :)

 

 

:hi:

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Get yourself CONVINCED and forget about others ...... :rolleyes:

 

Your career, your rice bowl and your future ....... :rofl:

 

Learn as much as you could and be safe .......... :)

 

 

:hi:

 

 

Thank you there, Wilco.

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Hi there everyone.

 

Im going to make it simple straight forward here. I'm a cadet pilot(private)of a local flying school here. About to graduate in 2 more weeks.

 

I'm very worried of not able to secure a job thereafter with our current aviation state. I'm aware that the big names like FY, AK, and even MAS are expanding their fleets as we speaking but to me the competition is very stiff.

 

Whilst giving a shot on direct intakes and what not, I was told by a friend that we ( the fresh grads) can opt to go to Indonesia, for type rating(on our own expense) and a job is guaranteed for us there. With B737 rating offered there and seeing that the opportunity is there, I was thinking, why not??

 

BUT, a big doubt here is...Well we all know that Indonesia got some safety issues on their aviation line...SO, I am wondering whether the HOURS I clocked flying there are going to be recognized by other airlines(outside Indo)if I am to hoop on later on?

 

Been trying to find the answer quite some time... Seem Most of you here are old-timer in this industry, I was thinking you guys might want to give a hand to this poor kid trying to dig some hole searching for a light for the sake of his future.... Thanks! =)

 

Hi Mohd,

I'm keen on taking up the private cadet course too lately am so passionate in avation

althought aged at 35 (maybe too late to start aviation career)

but my passion in flying will never die !

therefore, I would like to find out more info from you regarding your cadet course

do you mind to let me know more?

do you recomend the Asia Pacific FA ?

how are their equipments, system , management , instructors etc..?

hope to hear more from you soon.

 

wish you all the best in your pilot jon hunting

cheers bro ! ; )

 

Regard,

Andy

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Hi Andy,

 

If I may give you my opinion, aviation industry in M'sia is not as rosy as we saw it in newspaper especially to newbies (pilot). You need not less than RM250K in order to enroll into a flying school. Assuming everything went smoothly, you will be 37 by the time you graduate from the school. If you yourself as an employer, would you offer a job to a 22 years old guy or a 37 years old guy who possess the same amount of experience?

 

There are not many players in this country. Big players like MAS and Air Asia would prefer to take their own cadets although there would be a few 'private funded' cadets who are lucky enough to be offered a job by MAS or Air Asia. There are limited vacancies for newbies as mentioned earlier and most of the airlines in the world would not take 200 hrs pilot to fly their aeroplanes.

 

Yes if you don't try, you won't know but I am talking about reality here. If you have a deep pocket, then by all means, go ahead. However, if you are just looking for flying per se but not as a career, just join a club. Unofficial statistics, there are approx 700 newly graduated pilots who are still jobless in M'sia.

 

 

:hi:

Edited by Lock SH

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