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Airbus could be asked to ground all long-range airliners

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Airbus is expected to face calls to ground its worldwide fleet of long-range airliners tomorrow when French accident investigators issue their first account of what caused Air France Flight 447 to crash off Brazil on June 1.

 

It is believed that the accident bureau will report that faulty speed data and electronics were the main problem in the disaster that killed 228 people.

 

The European Aviation Safety Agency (EASA) is likely to be asked why it had never taken action to remedy trouble that was well known with the Airbus 330 and 340 series. Nearly 1,000 of the aircraft are flying and until AF447, no passenger had been killed in one.

 

“EASA has a legal and moral obligation to get to the bottom of this problem now. If there is a defective system and the aircraft is unsafe then it should be grounded,” said James Healy-Pratt of Stewarts Law in London. The firm, which specialises in aviation, is representing the families of 20 of the victims of flight 447.

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* Airbus crashes into ocean with 153 on board

 

* Body of Air France pilot Marc Dubois found

 

Only 11 bodies of the 50 recovered from the Atlantic have been identified. They include Captain Marc Dubois, 58, who is believed to have been resting when his two co-pilots lost control of the aircraft in a storm. The search for bodies has been called off but ships continue to hunt for the black boxes although their locator beacons are assumed to have expired.

 

Suspicion over the air data systems on the Airbus 330 and 340 series has increased after the disclosure that the aircraft had experienced 36 episodes similar to the one that brought Flight 447 down as it flew from Rio de Janeiro to Paris.

 

Airbus first reported problems with the speed sensors — known as pitot tubes — in 1994, it emerged this week. The company advised remedies, but no mandatory action was taken.

 

Last weekend, the US National Transportation Safety Board, began looking into two incidents in which Airbus A330s flying from the US suffered critical episodes apparently similar to that of AF447.

 

This raises the prospect of a possible US order on modifications to the Airbus.

 

The first US incident occurred on May 21 when a TAM Airlines flight from Miami to Sao Paulo, Brazil, lost primary speed and altitude information while in cruise flight. The other was on a Northwest Airlines flight, on June 23, from Hong Kong to Tokyo.

 

Accounts on the internet from the pilots report a desperate struggle to keep the jet in the air.

 

The fate of Flight 447 would probably have remained an eternal mystery had the aircraft not automatically transmitted data back to the Air France maintenance base.

 

In the final four minutes, they told a story that was familiar to the airline. Ice particles or water had blocked the three pitot tubes. This upset the air data computers which in turn caused the automatic pilot to disconnect. The pilots would have had to fly manually in near-impossible conditions.

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That's suicide! How many airlines will be affected? What about those whose fleets consists of ONLY long-range Airbuses? (D7 comes to mind). And what's this about a Northwest & TAM incident? Why didn't they take action before the AF crash? They could have done something to avoid the crash, but no, people have to die first before any action must be taken....

Edited by Mohd Suhaimi Fariz

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That's suicide! How many airlines will be affected? What about those whose fleets consists of ONLY long-range Airbuses? (D7 comes to mind)

 

Maybe they'll have to wetlease 747s or 777s if that happens. Do MH have any spares at this moment?

 

LX seems to have an Airbus-only fleet and they are gonna get screwed big time...

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Maybe they'll have to wetlease 747s or 777s if that happens. Do MH have any spares at this moment?

 

LX seems to have an Airbus-only fleet and they are gonna get screwed big time...

 

I'm sure it'll cost them a bundle! Unless they can work out something with MH, which I doubt. Last time anything like this, back in the 70's I believe with the DC-10, it was one of the contributing factor to the death of the Laker Skytrain.

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I'm sure it'll cost them a bundle! Unless they can work out something with MH, which I doubt. Last time anything like this, back in the 70's I believe with the DC-10, it was one of the contributing factor to the death of the Laker Skytrain.

 

I think it was more like PA and BA's predatory price wars rather than DC10 grounding after AA191 that forced Laker out.

 

Back on the topic, I forgot that maybe MH themselves need their planes, if any idle at this moment, to substitute the 330s...That means someone might need the planes from the desert :pardon: :pardon: and that Lion Air 744 :rofl: :rofl:

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The French asking for long range Airbuses to be grounded? I somehow doubt it.

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This kind of statement is normal, considering that it is coming from the lawyers representing the families of 20 of the victims of flight 447. The plane would be grounded, especially by the FAA, if it was thought to have serious life threatening defects.

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They must be dreaming . It is impossible to do such a thing . AND not to mention , if these other pilots said they had gone through such a thing , why didn't they do something about it then ? Why just let it slip ? Everything is becoming over dramatized .

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Adoi.. if it has those defect at the moment and are so life threatening, just ground the flights that involves flying through a bad weather... until a solution to the funny working pitots are resolved!! If they were so life threatening, a330 would be falling out of the skies everyday I tell u!!!

Edited by Ignatius

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Uh-oh...that could mean problem for the airline company operating all-Airbus fleet for long-range flights :blink:

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Did you see the DC-10 falling out of the sky every day :huh: Well the 330 and 340 could be the modern day dc-10 or next generation. I don't think anyone realised that the A340 will also be affected <_<

 

 

Adoi.. if it has those defect at the moment and are so life threatening, just ground the flights that involves flying through a bad weather... until a solution to the funny working pitots are resolved!! If they were so life threatening, a330 would be falling out of the skies everyday I tell u!!!

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There will be no problem with MH's A330-300s as they are using a different kind of pitot tubes. The three remaining A330-200 was using the same pitot tubes as the unfortunate AF447 but fortunately a modification was done not long ago and is now the same unit as the -300s. The affected pitot's are from Thales if I'm not mistaken.

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If a component or part may put aircraft to risk, Airbus will issue Mandatory Service Bulletin, and EASA and FAA may issue Airworthiness Directives to all operators with dateline to comply. Don’t believe either EASA or FAA will ground A330 or A340.

 

:drinks:

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i hope they won't. Or else Air asia X can say goodbye. hehe. But IMHO, grounding the bus is a step too far. Perhaps grounding A330's with the same type of pitots as AF 447, until they're replaced. But then again, how sure are we that it was solely due to the pitot tubes that cause AF447 to crash? It might be other component that we have yet to find out. If only we have the black box :(

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BTW, if its the pitot tube or airspeed unreliable, the a/c can still be flown isn't? Probably bot to the most efficient flying but as long as the engines were running, shouldn't have it stayed in the air longer? Still don't buy the reason for the crash.

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Bang on Aaron ! As long engine turn , u have dual generator fail also , still can go ! pitot out , still can go ! I'm bang on certain that the cause of the crash is not those tubes , but this is what the media is feasting on , thats all , just another scapegoat for the media , after all they will buy anything ......

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If the pitot tube was all iced up, it's going to be really hard to fly. Both PFD's giving different readings, I would assume speed well below stalling speed. Then all the warnings will come on, then the autopilot and autothurst would trip. Think about it, flying with these failures, at night and in turbulent condition, it's not going to be easy. Will definitely get disorientated easily. To ground all long range airbus? hmph....

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If the pitot tube was all iced up, it's going to be really hard to fly. Both PFD's giving different readings, I would assume speed well below stalling speed. Then all the warnings will come on, then the autopilot and autothurst would trip. Think about it, flying with these failures, at night and in turbulent condition, it's not going to be easy. Will definitely get disorientated easily. To ground all long range airbus? hmph....

 

What about heated pilot tube?

 

:yahoo:

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I'm not sure about airbus but Boeing do have a checklist for unreliable airspeed sort of setting the attitude and power settings then maintain a certain speed. That would help keep the aircraft in the air isnt?

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They can find the Yemeni A310 black box but they can't find the Air France A330 blackbox <_>

The Yemeni crash is nearer to the coast, in not so deep waters compared to the AF447 crash.

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They can find the Yemeni A310 black box but they can't find the Air France A330 blackbox <_>

The Comoros Islands' topography is quite different from that of the Atlantic Ocean. The Air France plane came down in waters that are up to 4,000m deep. If I remember correctly, the waters around the Indian Ocean islands are very shallow - remember the Ethiopian B767 crash? Survivors could just wade ashore...

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