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'KLIA East @ Labu’

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Somehow, at the back of my admittedly uninformed head, it feels like this is what TF really wants.

Now i hope the government do not screw this up.

 

After visiting the airport a few times (and with the help of google earth, i feel that the second satellite terminal area is best suited. I wonder if airasia will go back to the MTB for counter purposes.

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I think the area for the second Satellite should remain for the second Satellite.

 

In my opinion the new LCCT should be here:

 

52172707kp6.png

 

What area is that in the masterplan anyway? A second MTB?

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Well,I not sastified on the new LCCT terminal which proposed in Labu East. Howeever, if want to cr8 new LCCT, y dun we link all terminals 2gether?

 

Adminstration charges and other charges will be cut down thorugh the convinent by building aerotrains around.

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Hope THE MoF r....h m....r will award the operation of the new LCCT at KUL to another company. Believe any other airport or mall operator is better than MAHB.

 

:drinks:

 

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To be honest...i don't feel for TF's pain. He is making a big drama over nothing. Fine, he and MAHB may not get along but look at what he has done in the past. You give him a bit, he asks more even more. That's been on going for a good few years now.

He will NEVER be satisfied with what he has got. Firstly Subang, then LCCT, then Singapore and now Labu-Labi Fernandez international.

 

stop demanding and just work with what you've got.

IM AGREE WITH YOU Izanee

 

Klia East has been cancell now..goverment already make they decision and say NO NEW AIRPORT OUTSIDE KUALA LUMPUR :yahoo:

Edited by mohd sukri abd hamid

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Ryan wrote

 

You have a bunch of GLCs dealing with a gung-ho privately run company / conglomerate. Needless to say there WILL be a clash of cultures. So yes, I am grouping all the GLCs into one camp while AK is in the opposite side of the court.

 

Your views are ok Ryan. Definitely there is at least one GLC that is affected by AK, and that would be Mh, for obvious reasons. But your statement seems to indicate that MAHB and MH are in bed against AK, and MAHB is making things difficult for AK so MH can be in a better position.

 

I don't think that is true at all. MAHB probably has their reasons for being the way they are. But their disagreement with AK is not done for MH's benefit at all. I asked clarification merely on that count.

 

MH has always avoided having a verbal war with AK although through the years potshots have been taken against MH by AK. Perhaps the fact MH belongs to the Government requires the management to exercise restraint in its responses but AK, being a private concern, can say and do anything they want.

 

Definitely the ground is not level, but to think that it is to MH's advantage is not quite correct.

 

AK has done very very well, lots of people have gained from its low fares offerings, but it is two way and to think that that is done purely for the rakyat would be rather shortsighted. It would be very interesting to see how the future will be for AK with the current economic stuation.

 

They have two 180 seat A320 arriving per month, and that means an additional 2500 seats capacity per day for every 30 days. Then another additional 2500 seats per day gets added up every 30 days. It will be interesting to see where the additional pax are coming from locally to fill up those seats.

 

Probably DS Tony's brilliance can work something out.

 

Whatever it is, the Labu issue, whether it was real or another Sonic Cruiser tactic, has brought something good for AK. Good being relative that is.

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I was overjoyed with the report that the Labu airport was off. However read this that was reported in The Star. What's going on?

KUALA LUMPUR: The decision on AirAsia's proposal to build a new low-cost carrier terminal (LCCT) costing RM1.6bil in Labu, Negri Sembilan will be known in two to three weeks' time, said Transport Minister Datuk Seri Ong Tee Keat.

 

"Actually, the Government has not made a decision on the matter. What is important is that all the fact-finding and details arising will be scrutinised," he told Bernama after attending a Chinese New Year dinner function organised by the MCA, here, last night.

 

Ong said the Government needed time to decide on the matter as it involved many parties.

 

"The Transport Ministry, Economic Planning Unit, Finance Ministry, Malaysia Airports Holdings Bhd (MAHB) and AirAsia are meeting for the good of all parties concerned," he said.

 

Bernama had earlier yesterday reported that the Government had rejected the proposal for a new LCCT in Labu, but the low-cost carrier was said to have several concessions, according to sources.

 

It was reported that MAHB would be given the responsibility to build a new LCCT near the existing terminal, which is next to the Kuala Lumpur International Airport (KLIA) in Sepang.

 

The DPM said it's dead but the Transport Minister is still performing CPR...............

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What's the Transport Minister is up to?? Looks like he doesn't satisfied with the DPM decision to call off the KLIA East @ Labu-labi project.

 

Looks like 'Macam ada udang disebalik batu' (Something is fishy around here).

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n air asia LCCT owned and run by air asia does have its advantages as what tOny had mentioned - it will save AA alot of money in the region of rm100 million through landing fees, gate fees and other charges by MAB - which AA can used this savings towards their own airport. And AA will have full control over its flights in taking off n landings and this will also reduce their delays due to long peak waiting times at the KLIA runways.

However on the other side, of course to build another airport and so near to KLIA - will also render KLIA more to a white elephant status as when AA builds up its AA X international network, it will bite into MAS routes n load and hence resulting in reduced frequencies by MAS and resultant less traffic over at KLIA.

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KUALA LUMPUR, Jan 31 - Malaysia Airports Holdings , the country's sole airport operator, plans to build a low-cost terminal, newspapers reported on Saturday, a day after reports that budget airline AirAsia's proposal to build an airport was scrapped.

ADVERTISEMENT

 

AirAsia had planned to build and run its own airport in the central state of Negri Sembilan because in its view the budget carrier terminal at Kuala Lumpur's airport would not be able to handle future passenger growth.

 

But the 1.6 billion ringgit project, which would be the fourth airport in the Malaysian capital, attracted criticism from various quarters, including state investment arm Khazanah and former Prime Minister Mahathir Mohamad.

 

On Friday, sources told Reuters the AirAsia plan had been scrapped by the government.

 

The New Straits Times quoted an unidentified source as saying that Malaysia Airport Holdings would instead build a budget terminal near the existing one at Kuala Lumpur airport.

 

The company could not be immediately reached for comment.

 

However, AirAsia's airport fees may be lowered -- something the airline had been complaining about, according to a source.

 

AirAsia said late on Friday that a meeting chaired by Deputy Prime Minister Najib Razak had been very positive but gave no details.

 

A decision will be announced in two to three weeks, state news agency Bernama quoted Transport Minister Ong Tee Keat as saying.

 

 

THE MALAY ARTICLE :

 

NGO sokong kerajaan tolak LCCT Labu

 

KUALA LUMPUR 31 Jan. – Pertubuhan-pertubuhan bukan kerajaan (NGO) menyokong penuh langkah kerajaan menolak cadangan pembinaan Terminal Penerbangan Tambang Murah (LCCT) di Labu, Negeri Sembilan kerana ia tidak sesuai dilaksanakan dalam situasi kegawatan ekonomi dunia sekarang.

 

Menurut mereka, langkah kerajaan itu adalah tepat memandang Lapangan Terbang Antarabangsa Kuala Lumpur (KLIA) di Sepang masih mempunyai banyak ruang kosong bagi pembinaan sebuah lagi LCCT baru dengan kos pembinaan yang lebih murah.

 

Pengarah Projek Persatuan Pengguna Islam Malaysia (PPIM), Noor Nirwandy Mat Noordin berkata, pembinaan LCCT di Labu hanya akan mewujudkan pertindihan fungsi dengan KLIA yang kini merupakan hab pengangkutan udara utama negara.

 

Beliau berkata, dengan mengekalkan LCCT di KLIA, ia memudahkan pihak polis, imigresen dan bomba melakukan penyelarasan bagi mengawal kemudahan berkenaan tanpa perlu meletakkan anggota di dua tempat berlainan.

 

‘‘Saya berharap semua pihak mengikut pelan asal iaitu operasi pengangkutan udara utama negara hanya di KLIA sahaja,” katanya ketika dihubungi Mingguan Malaysia di sini hari ini.

 

Beliau mengulas laporan akhbar hari ini bahawa kerajaan menolak cadangan AirAsia Bhd. (AirAsia) untuk membina sebuah LCCT berharga RM1.6 bilion di Labu.

 

Sebaliknya, Malaysia Airports Holdings Bhd. (MAHB) diberi tanggungjawab membina sebuah LCCT yang baru, berdekatan terminal sekarang di KLIA.

 

Berikutan langkah itu, AirAsia berjaya mendapat jaminan mengenai caj dan cukai lapangan terbang lebih rendah yang akan dikenakan terhadapnya dan turut dibenarkan memberi input mengenai spesifikasi LCCT baru itu.

 

Noor Nirwandy berkata, keputusan itu membuktikan kerajaan komited untuk mengambil langkah penjimatan wang dalam suasana krisis ekonomi dunia sekarang.

Edited by Nabiel Haniff

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To be honest...i don't feel for TF's pain. He is making a big drama over nothing. Fine, he and MAHB may not get along but look at what he has done in the past. You give him a bit, he asks more even more. That's been on going for a good few years now.

He will NEVER be satisfied with what he has got. Firstly Subang, then LCCT, then Singapore and now Labu-Labi Fernandez international.

 

stop demanding and just work with what you've got.

 

This is exactly why we are where we are right now, a third world backwater, unknown between a financial capital south and tourism automotive giant north. Anyways why should he have to ask in the first place? That's the problem with our country, over regulation, government has to green light you on everything, it leads to people greasing politicians to get anywhere, which IS the situation in Malaysia (we can see the greasing of ministers can't we even in this labu debacle?). If this was in the deregulated US or Europe, this would have been a joke, I feel sorry for TF that He's being stifled in his operating environment.

 

Izanee, never being satisfied is the key to success, you can't and must not just sit still and "be satisfied with what he has got", the world of business is not static, its highly fluid, companies come and go, innovators are out to be better than you. Stopping innovators, competition is only at the expense of the larger economy. So anyways, it's a good thing that Dato' TF is not satisfied.

 

This sort of mentality is chronic and overly present within members of our society, people being just being "satisfied" with the way things are. There is room for improvement on every aspect, but just being satisfied is equivalent to complacency. Name most Malaysian GLCs and you can accuse them of being complacent at some period in time, "satisfied" as the government regulates the market to such an extent that they don't need to improve, be innovative. Lets see the various examples, Proton (gahmen protected the car market so it can supply expensive Japanese knock offs), our very own MH (taking forever with providing online booking, e-ticketing), KTM (train system that is woefully inefficient, tardy, and slow) and so on so forth, dare I say it MAHB as Ryan pointed out, inability to cope by changing it's plans, a key prerequisite of innovation (clearly a sign of being satisfied with the way things are!). There's nothing to be proud of if all we're satisfied in being is the local Jaguh Kampung.

 

If Petronas were satisfied with what they have, which is the domestic oil fields, they wouldn't be Global or a Fortune 500 company, a Malaysian global brand.

Edited by Mohd. Helmi

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yeah Helmi, you don't need to tell me what is the key to success. You need to constantly strive to improve yourself and not be satisfied...yes..i agree with that. But don't demand. Do the work yourself and don't expect it on a silver platter. that is the malaysian mentality which is prevailing even now in the 21st century.

 

We all have our own views i guess!

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Back to the "original" topic ...

 

I´ve kept myself waiting some time before starting to comment/contribute my ideas !

Now, that they are going to find a solution without building a new ("shadow") airport next to KLIA i must say i could hardly believe that a separate airport right next to KLIA would ever be build.

 

It would have been extremely rediculous - economy wise - and even considering AK´s growth in the past and that grow to be expected in the foreseeable future would not justify a separate airport.

 

Actually it seems to me (from a foreign point of view) that MAHB management is simply not willing to do the neccessary steps to keep AK and possible other LCC´s happy.

As far as i know the LCCT there´s still sufficient space to build a new terminal that will be sufficient for AK´s growth.

 

It´s certainly not a good idea to mix premium and LCC passengers for MAHB - revenue wise -

But it´s rediculous - no, stupid to block smoothe interchange of passengers from both markets.

Which unfortunately is done intentionally in various ways.

It´s o.k. to put LCC´s on the opposite side of the airport in a separate terminal from the legacies but not acceptable to run the LCCT like a separate airport!

 

What KLIA needs are:

 

1) A significantly bigger LCC terminal with an option to extend it even further when need arises.

2) Regular reliable and properly signposted shuttle between KLIA and LCCT - preferably either a people mover or a train connection.

Although this is not going to be a cheap solution (as it would require a tunnel between KLIA and LCCT) it would greatly improve the overall effectiveness of KLIA as a hub - actually KLIA is not even close to being a true hub because synergies are not used at all !!!

3) Much better access by public transport - it still goes beyond me why the KLIAexpress track was not extended to the LCCT especially as the typical LCC customer will not go to/from the airport by car ...

 

If KLIAexpress is considered a premium product dedicated solely to KLIAs customers (as one can see when comparing the fares with the coach links to Sentral) why not run "local" trains to the LCCT ???

The mentioned excuses for not offering any rail access to LCCT are a joke !

Next to this i have yet to experience a KLIAexpress train being sufficiently occupied with passengers to make it profitable (or do i get it wrong and the low usage is more than compensated by the outragous fare that´s charged ??? )

More reasonable pricing with much higher load factor (fed by travellers from the LCCT) would be a better solution !

 

A further step would be offering an integrated public transport system in the greater KL area (having in mind what we are used to here in Germany)

It seems that KLIA together with KL city still has a long way to go until a level similar to e.g. HKG or SIN is reached !!!

 

This are just my 2 cents ...

Jürgen

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If KLIAexpress is considered a premium product dedicated solely to KLIAs customers (as one can see when comparing the fares with the coach links to Sentral) why not run "local" trains to the LCCT ???

 

Juergen, there's no such thing as local train in Malaysia (comparable to RB or S-Bahn in Germany). The closest would be KTM Komuter from KL Sentral is to Nilai but travel time could be reaching up to 1h 30mins to LCCT. Which is better if you take a bus. As bus would take about 1h to LCCT. I rather doubt it the government willing to spend another penny to extend the train network to the Airport since ERL is sufficient enough.

 

On the same topics rather than extend the KTM lines for about 22km it is cheaper to extend the ERL 7km. ERL is not extended to the current LCCT simply because it is not a permanent terminal.

 

It will be a waste of resource if the ERL is extended to current LCCT than later have to demolish it when the permanent LCCT is constructed and extended to that terminal.

 

More reasonable pricing with much higher load factor (fed by travellers from the LCCT) would be a better solution !

 

The prices tag of ERL direct to KLIA from KLSentral at MYR35 is in order to make the taxi operator to KLIA happy if I am not mistaken. The fare to KLIA from KL city centre is about MYR50. only MYR15 difference.

You see if you take KLIA Transit and change train at Putrajaya (waiting 30mins for next train) you only pay about MYR15.70 to KLIA.. Meaning ERL can actually put a price tag of MYR15.70 to KLIA from KLSentral.

If the price of ERL at MYR15.70. ERL will gain market shares substantially and could even put the taxi operator out of business. Since the difference now is at MYR34. Malaysian Government won't allow it.

 

 

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In most airports worldwide except in the third world, ground transportation is integral part of airport. Transport integration is to provide seamless, cheap and cost effective transfer between the two modes of transport and airport is only a node in the transportation system.

 

The LCCT at KUL has proved air travellers need cheap ground transportation and cheap ground transportation promote air travelling.

 

Since SZB, ground transportation at airports in Malaysia is monopolized to increase cost of travelling for benefit of cronies :finger: :angry: At MTB KUL;

1. Airport taxi is a monopoly.

2. To protect the airport taxi, city taxi is banned from picking up customers from the airport and add surcharge to taxi fare from the city.

3. ERL is priced to maximum marginal price despite ERL is subsidised by every airport users whether the train service is use or not.

4. Bus service is dismay at KUL. While operating as monopoly, bus frequency was either every 30 minutes or hourly, and ticket again was priced to maximum marginal price.

5. Car park charge is comparable to upmarket shopping mall in the city and is discouraging long term parking.

 

Believe ground transportation at MTB is expensive, inefficient and a rip off, which contribute to KUL failure to become a hub.

 

:drinks:

 

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In most airports worldwide except in the third world, ground transportation is integral part of airport. Transport integration is to provide seamless, cheap and cost effective transfer between the two modes of transport and airport is only a node in the transportation system.

 

The LCCT at KUL has proved air travellers need cheap ground transportation and cheap ground transportation promote air travelling.

 

Since SZB, ground transportation at airports in Malaysia is monopolized to increase cost of travelling for benefit of cronies :finger: :angry: At MTB KUL;

1. Airport taxi is a monopoly.

2. To protect the airport taxi, city taxi is banned from picking up customers from the airport and add surcharge to taxi fare from the city.

3. ERL is priced to maximum marginal price despite ERL is subsidised by every airport users whether the train service is use or not.

4. Bus service is dismay at KUL. While operating as monopoly, bus frequency was either every 30 minutes or hourly, and ticket again was priced to maximum marginal price.

5. Car park charge is comparable to upmarket shopping mall in the city and is discouraging long term parking.

 

Believe ground transportation at MTB is expensive, inefficient and a rip off, which contribute to KUL failure to become a hub.

 

:drinks:

I think it will be sufficient to say that the mantra of "opening up to allow competition for the overall good" is still an idea that is very foreign to MAHB. Noting on how the Transport Minister is still trying to revive the Labu project, I hope it is just mere hot-gas from a dying galaxy. There has never been a more crucial time for KLIA to consolidate their resources into one giant hub and be a force to reckon with.

 

One thing I have to point out about the parking system in KLIA. There are several entrances for token and TnG exclusive use. Hoever it is not indicated at the start of the ramp where the cars go down to enter. At the first ramp I entered, the gantry was not working BUT THERE WAS NO SIGN at the start. I had to reverse my way out and thankfully there was no car behind me. At the next entrance, it was TnG ONLY but there was no sign to indicate this - not until I reached the gantry. Luckily I have TnG with me otherwise how? Reverse out again? I can imagine the cars behind me cursing "wah lau not another stupid Singaporean car!".

 

Signage people... SIGNAGE!

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Ok this is a rough one from me. It is whether MAHB wants to or not but problems can be solved I think by using that square plot of empty land next to the satellite building. Connect it immediately next to the Satellite Terminal and connection problem solved. Present Aerotrain services can be used to bring pax to MTB and Concourse C can be linked to the "permanent" airside-LCCT via a Gatwick-styled Skybridge. How cool! But this would also mean that AK has to use MTB for their landside services. This is what "consolidation" means, right?

 

Alternatively check in can still be done at the present LCCT but frequent bus services can bring airside passengers to the "permanent" airside-LCCT marked out by me. So what do you think?

 

KLIA01.jpg

 

KLIA's non-LCC passenger numbers are unlikely to rise to the point where concourses A, B and C will be maxed out so might as well release that empty plot to capitalise on AK's growth. It has been set aside by the KLIA-masterplan anyway!

Edited by Ryan Soh

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A blog entry relating to the Labu Labi airport fracas, written by a prominent Malaysian blogger, from a consumer's perspective.

 

http://www.kennysia.com/archives/2009/01/in-support-of-k.php

 

Hehehe ... good stuff, kennysia. :good:

 

Thanks to TF and the AKX gang, next week Consumer Me am off to OOL enroute to SYD, then back to KUL via MEL, at half the price other airlines are charging. :D

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My version of the permanent LCCT

 

KLIA01.jpg

 

Mine is BLUE

Ryan Soh's is BLACK. Does it resembles any Chinese character with a specific meaning anyway?

 

Although the emply plot set aside for the second Satellite Terminal seems like a good place for the terminal, the fact that it has been set as an 'island' terminal makes it difficult for AirAsia's business model. If that site is chosen, AirAsia passengers need to be ferried with the aerotrain etc, I don't think it will result in low construction cost and later on, low airport passengers services fee that AirAsia is mulling about.

 

I am not sure about the exact location of the permanent LCCT, but I think the site that I highlighted as BLUE is the place (am I right?). It is located in between the Bunga Raya Complex and Runway 14L (?). This area is parallel to KUL MTB, which will make the ERL extension short and easier, while it is well connected to Jalan Pekeliling, not far from the MTB, perfect for Skybus and Aerobus services from KL Sentral. This 2 bus companies can now also serve the passengers who are going to MTB from KL Sentral.

 

I had this in mind for a very long time actually since the issue of no suitable place for a permanent LCCT being raised, IF the Bunga Raya Complex is not there, it would make life of so many people much easier isn't it? The Permanent LCCT can be built right next to the MTB and it can be linked with a bridge too. *If only we can demolished the Bunga Raya Complex!*

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My idea? Incorporate both Azizul and Ryan's plan. Azizul plan will be the check in terminal - so the size can be smaller, whilst the Ryan's plan should be the satellite terminal since it has got more 'surface area' to 'cater TF's hunger' for more parking spaces for his ever increasing number of aircrafts... but then again, this would the only LCC who got satellite terminal... is it? Just my 2 cent...

Edited by Yusoff

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Ryan Soh's is BLACK. Does it resembles any Chinese character with a specific meaning anyway?

 

Depends on how you look. It can be either "土" which can mean "earth" or ”gaudy", or "干" which can mean "dry" or used the same way as the f-word...I don't think he intends to mean either way though...

 

Maybe we can extend a wing from MTB and make it LCCT?

 

BTW where is the Bunga Raya Complex?

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